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Steven,

Thanks for the post. Nice to see the 550 beat the Diablo, looks like it got just above 360HP. Was it just the three of you?

Also what kind of Dyno? There is an interesting topic below where 4i2fly had his 360 Dynoed. There is another member (modenatwinturbo) that has lots of info on Dynos and I believe he is in your area. Thanks for sharing, looks awesome.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Enzo250GTO.

There were more then three of us, but those are the pics i have. Was also busy with the facility discussing the new race setup on the 308 that is here. It is the one with ever-climbing DYNO as the fluids were cold. The car has been there a few weeks having new suspension bits and all new bushings, etc.

The Dyno info is at http://www.ktrperformance.com/services/dyno_tuning.htm

Yes, each Dyno is different and this one takes into account the air temp, humidity, intake, etc conditions.
 

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Cool! I'm scared to put my car on a dyno. Ignorance is bliss.
 

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Steven,

Thanks for the link. That 4WD dyno is awesome for the 911 TT. I believe the other dyno that was used last time was a dyno jet and I cannot remember if the dyno took into account all those factors or not.
 

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Different Dynos can rate different PLUS 10HP is within a range. Add to the the engine had only 600 miles on it so it was probably a bit "tight" still. That could easily account for things.
 

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enjoythemusic said:
Different Dynos can rate different PLUS 10HP is within a range. Add to the the engine had only 600 miles on it so it was probably a bit "tight" still. That could easily account for things.
Thanks for the reply, the 600 miles on CS may account for some. The dyno result I am referring to is from your own website
http://www.ktrperformance.com/services/Dyno_Graphs/Other/graph_360modena_stock.htm
and was performed on the same dyno type (or is it?). CS has 420 HP, 25 HP more than Modena. If anything I would expect it to read 10 HP more than the Modena. I am confused.

Thanks,
 

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4i2fly,

Good questions! The KTR website is not "mine", but where we went to have the cars done. The difference could be due to a "tight" engine, different fluids, perhaps a different air intake (K&N versus stock filter), perhaps different gas, etc. It would be interesting to redyno the 360CS after it had 5,000 miles and fluid changes.

As an example, the Euro spec 1985 308GTS QV was getting better with each run due to the fluids reaching their optimum temps (see last graph at http://www.enjoythemusic.com/dynoday0504/ ). IMHO she never reached TRUE full temps as the car had been at KTR for 50+ days getting all new suspension bushings and more modern coil over shocks installed. The 50+ days is due to my loss of license and not being in a rush to get her back home. So in this case we have to account for fluids not at optimum temps, old gas in the tank, etc. The first run was 10HP lower than the last run taken within a mere few minutes apart... as this is "only 171HP total, not the 360CS' 300HP. So the percentage is smaller with the 360CS versus the 308GTS QV.

Hope this may bring more understanding in this matter.

Enjoy the Drive,

Steven R. Rochlin
http://www.EnjoyTheMusic.com
 

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enjoythemusic said:
Hi Everyone,

Sponsored a Dyno Day yesterday here in New England (USA). Pics are at http://www.enjoythemusic.com/dynoday0504/ . Interesting numbers at the wheel.
Hi Steve,
Good to see you over here.
I ran mine last month. It started out at 168 HP and went up to 176.5 after the fifth pull, 6100 RPM . Cold fluids etc...................
it was on a Win PEP Dyno.

DJ
Hows Billiebird?
 

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Spasso,

Agreed about "cold" fluids and the ones i use in her are made to operate best when she is being driven hard... because she loves it that way. Billie is doing great and coming with me to a show in NYC in a few weeks :)
 

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I am running 20-50 VR1 Valvoline in my engine which I am sure causes an amount of parasitic drag.

Cool bird=chick magnet 8)
 

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hey enjoythemusic

where did this event take place in new england exactly.. i am located in southern connecticut.

hery Pete

dont be scared of getting the baby dynoed.. there is nothing that will happen to the car on the dyno that wouldnt have happend on the road at full throttle. they are just as safe as ful thottleing the car on the road.

******this does not apply if there is engine calibration going on*****


Ed-
 

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It may also have to do with what gear the Dyno pull ocurred in. Does the CS car have different gear ratios? When you do a dyno pull the gear that is as close to 1:1 is going to give you the best "real world" results. I can only speak from my experience with tuning on other MR2s but math is math and physics is physics. The same priciples apply to all. Most of the pulls we do are in 3rd and then 4th gear. The 4th gear pulls always show a lower HP reading.

"Every car I've ever dyno tested in both 3rd and 4th has made more RWHP in 3rd, with worse spool characteristics. It's basic physics. The dyno is measuring how fast you are accelerating a mass with known inertia. (the roller) Your car is obviously going to accelerate the roller faster in third gear than it does in 4th. The reason the spool is worse in third is because there is less load on the engine, and less time for the turbo to fully spool. If your car made more hp in 4th, my money says you had some other variable between the runs, other than what gear the car was in. (whether were aware of that variable is another thing)"- KO Racing

Now we all know the 360 doesn't have a turbo but the same basic physics apply the HP variation just won't be as dramatic as that of a turbo car. If the CS has a slightly dif ratio in any of the gears and they weren't aware of it, to make adjustments to the calculations, they probably ran it with the same ratios in the computer.

So, does teh CS have diff ratios? Gears 1-6 or differential ratio?
 

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CS has the same gear ratio as the Modena. It is however rated at 409 HP in the users manual than what we've been reading in magazines and Ferrari brochures. Given slight increase in HP over Modena and bigger wheels and break rotors, I would expect the RWHP be less than of Modena. The CS dynoed here is bearly over the break in miles and is not good measure for HP. He should re-dyno after a few thousond miles. I would expect the HP to go up when the engine has settled in well.

Cheers,
senna21 said:
It may also have to do with what gear the Dyno pull ocurred in. Does the CS car have different gear ratios? When you do a dyno pull the gear that is as close to 1:1 is going to give you the best "real world" results. I can only speak from my experience with tuning on other MR2s but math is math and physics is physics. The same priciples apply to all. Most of the pulls we do are in 3rd and then 4th gear. The 4th gear pulls always show a lower HP reading.

"Every car I've ever dyno tested in both 3rd and 4th has made more RWHP in 3rd, with worse spool characteristics. It's basic physics. The dyno is measuring how fast you are accelerating a mass with known inertia. (the roller) Your car is obviously going to accelerate the roller faster in third gear than it does in 4th. The reason the spool is worse in third is because there is less load on the engine, and less time for the turbo to fully spool. If your car made more hp in 4th, my money says you had some other variable between the runs, other than what gear the car was in. (whether were aware of that variable is another thing)"- KO Racing

Now we all know the 360 doesn't have a turbo but the same basic physics apply the HP variation just won't be as dramatic as that of a turbo car. If the CS has a slightly dif ratio in any of the gears and they weren't aware of it, to make adjustments to the calculations, they probably ran it with the same ratios in the computer.

So, does teh CS have diff ratios? Gears 1-6 or differential ratio?
 

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Wow, some of those numbers seem REALLY low... :eek: 360hp for the 550?? My bone stock 03 Mustang Cobra put 371hp and 378 ft-lbs to the wheels... What kind of dyno was it?
 

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Enzo250GTO said:
Steven,

Thanks for the link. That 4WD dyno is awesome for the 911 TT. I believe the other dyno that was used last time was a dyno jet and I cannot remember if the dyno took into account all those factors or not.
I'm not sure if it's the dyno or the software (or whatever), but Dynojets will account for temp, humidity, etc. They can rate at actual hp (what your car actually put down), STD, or SAE figures. Typically, SAE is the most widely accepted figure as it is standardized for temp and humidity.
 
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