Water pump....change or not??? - Ferrari Life
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 16 Old 10-31-2011, 05:36 PM Thread Starter
Owner
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Ferrari Life Posts: 48
Water pump....change or not???

So we're doing the major on my TR. Car has 13k miles. My mechanic told me the last time he did a rebuild kit it leaked and he had a lot of issues getting it to seal. The pump on the car isn't leaking...seems he's more inclined to leave it on rather than mess with it. Thoughts??

Thanks!!
TRChad is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 16 Old 10-31-2011, 05:51 PM
Owner
Elite Member
 
wetpet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Chevy Chase, Md
Ferrari Life Posts: 9,567
wetpet is offline  
post #3 of 16 Old 10-31-2011, 05:57 PM
Owner
 
barcheta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Maryland
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,875
+1... its not that much money and is piece of mind.

Current: 85' GTS QV
It's a simple process...... it's just complicated by human beings....
barcheta is offline  
 
post #4 of 16 Old 10-31-2011, 06:50 PM Thread Starter
Owner
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Ferrari Life Posts: 48
Is there a particular rebuild kit that works better?
TRChad is offline  
post #5 of 16 Old 10-31-2011, 06:55 PM
Owner
Elite Member
 
tazandjan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Ferrari Life Posts: 11,856
Brian, TR Water Pump?

Chad- Give Daniel at Ricambi a call and get his recommendation.

If you are really lucky, Brian Crall will also chime in on the answer.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
tazandjan is offline  
post #6 of 16 Old 10-31-2011, 10:57 PM
Administrator
Owner
Elite Member
 
Boxer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: UK & Texas
Ferrari Life Posts: 15,131
I would do it.

If you don't and it goes bad, it is an engine out job to get to it again.
Boxer is offline  
post #7 of 16 Old 11-01-2011, 06:04 AM
Owner
 
Petervg1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Ferrari Life Posts: 42
I am currently doing a 30k service on my TR and I change all seals and bearings. It's not that much money extra (+/- $100) and I don't want to pull the engine out in the next 5 years.
Petervg1 is offline  
post #8 of 16 Old 11-01-2011, 06:35 AM
Owner
 
Brian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Austin Texas
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,833
If he feels sqeemish about a waterpump he has no business doing a major.


It should be updated/modified to take the 355/550 seal anyway.



I have very strong opinions on who to select to work on these cars based on a few decades of seeing them butchered and I have serious reservations about anyone who shys away from the Ferrari equivalent of changing socks or fails to grasp the need to do so.

Last edited by Brian; 11-01-2011 at 07:07 AM.
Brian is offline  
post #9 of 16 Old 11-01-2011, 07:09 AM
Owner
 
Saint Bastage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Essex Connecticut
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,839
Why is this a question? Is it a financial thing or is there some schedule/time issue involved?

Just re-read and saw where there was a history of leaks after a rebuild. I've never met your mechanic and don't know who he is but my first question would be "why did the last rebuild fail?". Was there some problem with your water pump/rebuild kit or was there an issue with the way it was rebuilt? Being afraid to replace bearings and seals because of a problem in the past seems odd.

Lane

Previous owner of 348ts SS #64, Now Ferrariless

Last edited by Saint Bastage; 11-01-2011 at 07:15 AM.
Saint Bastage is offline  
post #10 of 16 Old 11-01-2011, 07:27 AM
Owner
Elite Member
 
wetpet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Chevy Chase, Md
Ferrari Life Posts: 9,567
well said and to the point as always. I am constantly amazed at people's need to believe. Need to believe they can get it done cheaper/faster. You can tell them their mechanic has little knowledge or experience on these cars, hell you can demonstrate it, and if the price is lower, even by a little bit they WANT to believe. They don't need to be talked into it. My other pet peeve is the people that take it to the dealer out of some belief that they have some magic pixie dust that the manufacturer only sells to them.

here is a tip for everyone looking for a ferrari mechanic. If you go in the shop and all the mechanics look like they are under 21----THEY ARE!!! and everything that implies.

OP this is a general rant and not directed at you. i have no knowledge of you, your car or your mechanic. Wait, i do know a little about your mechanic...

ps. would love to have seen the unedited brian post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian View Post
If he feels sqeemish about a waterpump he has no business doing a major.


It should be updated/modified to take the 355/550 seal anyway.



I have very strong opinions on who to select to work on these cars based on a few decades of seeing them butchered and I have serious reservations about anyone who shys away from the Ferrari equivalent of changing socks or fails to grasp the need to do so.


100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3

Last edited by wetpet; 11-01-2011 at 07:33 AM.
wetpet is offline  
post #11 of 16 Old 11-01-2011, 07:38 AM
Owner
Elite Member
 
wetpet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Chevy Chase, Md
Ferrari Life Posts: 9,567
just had a thought. if everybody took their cars to quality places like brian's and richard and fernando's, they would have to expand and train new mechanics the right way. how would that be?



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3
wetpet is offline  
post #12 of 16 Old 11-01-2011, 12:15 PM Thread Starter
Owner
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Ferrari Life Posts: 48
Guys I appreciate the help. Let me make one thing clear...the decision to potentially "not" do this has NOTHING to do with finances. I think we can all agree, when you're talking about a 30K major....a pump is peanuts. It's all peanuts except for the clutch, throw out bearing. flywheel etc. The reason I'm not considering doing this is because a new one is no longer available....he claims that the pump...once removed...is sometimes diffacult to get to seat right and often times leaks. It's not leaking a drop now. He claims it might be best not to mess with it. Something about a friction seal. Also, if I'm going to do the rebuild kit it might be best to send the pump off to a machine shop and have it all redone???? This is all new to me. So far, we are doing belts, seals, tensioners, clutch, starter etc. The works.
TRChad is offline  
post #13 of 16 Old 11-01-2011, 12:22 PM
Owner
Elite Member
 
tazandjan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Ferrari Life Posts: 11,856
Chad- Personally, I would find someone who is not afraid of a water pump leak after a rebuild. Brian says using an updated seal will fix the problem, and if your mechanic does not already know that trick, it might be better to find someone who does.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
tazandjan is offline  
post #14 of 16 Old 11-01-2011, 12:42 PM
Master Mechanic
 
ECSofVirginia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Austin, TX
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,219
Even if the pump is not currently leaking and the car has low mileage, the effects coolant and water have on the pump internals over the many years is a real concern. There is no easy solution if the pump fails after the fact, replacing it without pulling the engine is a total nightmare...so it needs to get pulled again.

The complications that may be encountered now will be much less of an issue than the complications in a year or two when the pump does become a problem. Everything on these older cars require additional time and effort to get right, As long as you the client understands it "take what it takes" to do the job right leaving things be is a poor solution.

A couple years ago I did a major on a TR that "just had a major", yet puked coolant and oil everywhere. Once the water pump was taken apart it appeared as though it actually had never been cleaned up and rebuilt. The internal parts were completely rusted together an non-usable.

Picking and choosing items on an engine out service is a gamble I don't like to take.


ECSofVirginia is offline  
post #15 of 16 Old 11-01-2011, 12:46 PM
Owner
 
Brian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Austin Texas
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,833
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRChad View Post
Guys I appreciate the help. Let me make one thing clear...the decision to potentially "not" do this has NOTHING to do with finances. I think we can all agree, when you're talking about a 30K major....a pump is peanuts. It's all peanuts except for the clutch, throw out bearing. flywheel etc. The reason I'm not considering doing this is because a new one is no longer available....he claims that the pump...once removed...is sometimes diffacult to get to seat right and often times leaks. It's not leaking a drop now. He claims it might be best not to mess with it. Something about a friction seal. Also, if I'm going to do the rebuild kit it might be best to send the pump off to a machine shop and have it all redone???? This is all new to me. So far, we are doing belts, seals, tensioners, clutch, starter etc. The works.


New pumps were never available per se. The pump is an integral part of the motor. It just needs to be diasassembled, cleaned up and 2 seals installed. SOP on Ferrari 12 cylinder motors since the very early days.
Brian is offline  
post #16 of 16 Old 11-03-2011, 01:28 AM
Owner
 
Petervg1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Ferrari Life Posts: 42
Water pump parts

I just purchased the seals and bearings for my '87 TR waterpump.


These are the parts that I'll replace:
  • 101023 Seal
  • 120948 Seal
  • 121553 Seal
  • 121165 Seal
  • 133899 Bearing (2x)
  • 152051 Backplate
I guess you can call that a major for the waterpump


Also, because you have to take off the waterpump housing, you should replace the housing gasket which is:
  • 134947 Gasket
I bought the water pump seal kit from Superformance and the rest of the parts from Eurospares (Eurospares could not supply the most important seal 120948). Total cost was 77 pounds which is about $125.

And..., if a mechanic knows what he is doing, he should not be afraid to replace parts, even not when it's a Ferrari.
Petervg1 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome
Copyright 2012 ONE Media, Inc.
FerrariLife is independently run with no affiliation with Ferrari SpA
Ferrari for Sale | Maserati for Sale