F50 gear box sound ?! - Ferrari Life
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post #1 of 26 Old 05-13-2012, 08:39 AM Thread Starter
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F50 gear box sound ?!

Just came back from a wonderful 70 km drive with the F50. What a wonderful machine. After the long Fled 6 drive with "D", the change of driving feeling is incredible.
Before driving into the Garage, I quickly checked the oil level while "F" was idling. By doing this I leaned over the gearbox and believed to hear a funny noise. It was kind like a slight "knocking" inside the gear box, maybe the differential. The car at the time was very hot as I have pushed to 8'000 rpms several tims before, of course under perfect water and oil temperature. Again while driving gearchanging was smooth as always, car runned great. Maybe I'm just too sensible but I was wondering if anything with the gearbox oil level could be the cause ? Any ideas ?
Thanks for any thoughts.
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post #2 of 26 Old 05-13-2012, 10:33 AM
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212- You can have someone drain the transaxle oil and check the filter (33) if it would make you feel better. With no load in neutral, a little noise from the gearbox would not surprise me. Maybe Boxer can chime in and tell you whether his does the same thing.

Wow, that filter is only $10 from Ricambi. Did not know there was anything that inexpensive for an F50.
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post #3 of 26 Old 05-13-2012, 12:01 PM Thread Starter
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Dear Terry, I was hoping you would reply will do so. Anyway when starting the engine when it was cold again the noise was less obvious and it quite possibly could come from the differential. However its really more like "teethed metal wheels" running together. Kind of this mechanical sounds which are really present on different locations on the F50. Maybe the problem is that I never opened the hood so far when idling and listening to that noise specifically. However to make sure I will drain the oil and check that filter. Called Boxer already before but he's not aware of any sounds on his F50, however I would rate that as well very subjective.
The more I think about it makes me hard to believe that the way the engine is running (smoothly) and the way I'm able to change gears (smoothly again) something serious should be wrong. Maybe my subjectivity just makes me kind of too alert. Many thanks for your effort.
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post #4 of 26 Old 05-13-2012, 12:12 PM
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If the noise you hear from the gearbox is while the car is standing still with the engine idling it could be the thrust bearing making a sound.
To verify whether it is a thrust bearing noise have someone depress the clutch whilst the engine is running.
If the noise goes away it is thrust bearing related if it stays it is not.

Shot in the dark but next time I am in your neighbourhood I shall stop for a LOOK SEE.
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post #5 of 26 Old 05-13-2012, 08:15 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a1exander View Post
If the noise you hear from the gearbox is while the car is standing still with the engine idling it could be the thrust bearing making a sound.
To verify whether it is a thrust bearing noise have someone depress the clutch whilst the engine is running.
If the noise goes away it is thrust bearing related if it stays it is not.

Shot in the dark but next time I am in your neighbourhood I shall stop for a LOOK SEE.
Thanks Peter, will check today.
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post #6 of 26 Old 05-13-2012, 08:36 PM
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In the world of aviation, there is a well known phenomenon - New pilots frequently hear strange sounds from their airplanes just as they are starting to become familiar with them. As the newness wears off and they are less overwhelmed by the new airframe, they start to notice all kinds of sounds that never registered before. Yet the sounds were there all the time.

212, I am willing to bet that you are now at that stage with your F50. I won't be surprised if you start discovering all sorts of new things about the car you didn't know during the first ____kms.

Of course, the flip side of that coin is that hyper-sensitivity frequently lets them discover problems right at inception. Hope that's not the case here.

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post #7 of 26 Old 05-13-2012, 09:53 PM Thread Starter
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In the world of aviation, there is a well known phenomenon - New pilots frequently hear strange sounds from their airplanes just as they are starting to become familiar with them. As the newness wears off and they are less overwhelmed by the new airframe, they start to notice all kinds of sounds that never registered before. Yet the sounds were there all the time.

212, I am willing to bet that you are now at that stage with your F50. I won't be surprised if you start discovering all sorts of new things about the car you didn't know during the first ____kms.

Of course, the flip side of that coin is that hyper-sensitivity frequently lets them discover problems right at inception. Hope that's not the case here.
I tend to believe that your are right. My mechanic is quickly coming in half an hour and then I will know more hopefully. Thanks.
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post #8 of 26 Old 05-13-2012, 11:10 PM Thread Starter
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Just came back from a 30 km warm up drive with my mechanic. Everything ok and normal according to him. When we initially started the engine, I followed Peters recommondation to push the clutch and the slight "clacking" from the thrust bearing went away. We then went for the drive to fully warm up the engine and when comming back the slight "clacking" was the same, no difference between cold and warm.
My mechanic, unkown about what you said Peter, said to me the same, that this almost unhearable "clacking" most likely comes from the thrust bearing but that I should be assured that it is totally common and not noisy at all (my ears seem to be too sensible) with the F50 with all its very direct mechanical applications especially in low rpm's levels when no load pressure is applied. Nothing to worry about. He mentioned the the car runs absolutely beautiful. He also mentioned that typically the strongest noise from the thrust bearing of all F-types to his knowledge comes with the 355.
So I will leave it that way. Thanks to all of you knowledgable people out there. Your thoughts are a great input to me.
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post #9 of 26 Old 05-14-2012, 02:37 AM
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Surely there can't be many long-time F50 owners that still have sensitive ears left?

So you will hear fewer and fewer funny noises as the years pass.

Glad to hear she is OK!


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post #10 of 26 Old 05-14-2012, 03:24 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JazzyO View Post
Surely there can't be many long-time F50 owners that still have sensitive ears left?

So you will hear fewer and fewer funny noises as the years pass.

Glad to hear she is OK!


Onno
Thanks Onno. Yes over the years I will hear less and less but because I get older and older !
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post #11 of 26 Old 05-14-2012, 05:47 AM
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Good one Onno!

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post #12 of 26 Old 05-14-2012, 06:14 AM
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I suppose being aware of the noises a car makes and becoming sensitised to them is what distinguishes one as a "sympathetic" driver.

And your expert is correct the 355 when idling can at times sound like a bucket of bolts being rattled. I would worry if I did not hear the thrust bearing.
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post #13 of 26 Old 05-14-2012, 07:03 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a1exander View Post
I suppose being aware of the noises a car makes and becoming sensitised to them is what distinguishes one as a "sympathetic" driver.

And your expert is correct the 355 when idling can at times sound like a bucket of bolts being rattled. I would worry if I did not hear the thrust bearing.
Thanks for your check up Peter !
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post #14 of 26 Old 05-14-2012, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 212Export View Post
Thanks Onno. Yes over the years I will hear less and less but because I get older and older !
This is probably why I never noticed anything on mine
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post #15 of 26 Old 05-14-2012, 12:59 PM
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20 years of flying fighters has cured me of worrying about many noises. Could you repeat that, please?

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post #16 of 26 Old 05-28-2012, 01:14 AM Thread Starter
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Yesterday when driving the F50 for about 20 minutes, suddenly it felt like the car had difficulty with the gazoline flow or some ignition "cuts" inbetween when accelerating. I stoped right at my mechanic garage (1 km away) opened the engine hood and that "rattling" at idle was obvious again (like ignitions errors sometimes). Interestingly there was no error or any other message showing up on the dashboard but my mechanic said we need to run the electronic tester thru it. As my mechanic doesn't has that electronic tester, I will go and see the official F-dealer for this on Tuesday/Wednesday.
Anyway, I decided to take the F50 for a slow warm up drive again this morning and it runned perfectly again. I imagined that the "problem" has to be on the electronic side. Then it came to my mind that the problem may be initiated bymyself. Please do not laugh at me ...but this is my procedure when coming back from a drive: I turn OFF the battery (used from the classics) as soon as I'm arriving in my garage and.....obviously start and turn ON the battery before heading off. Now I'm not the guy who let the car idle when starting for 10 minutes (because of neighbors and else) but when reactivating the battery of the F50, thats exactly what I should have done (as my mechanic said after I told him about this/my procedure which he did not know about before). He told me that the system needs to be runed for about 10 minutes at idle to rebalance/map itself, before heading off.......!? Hmmm

So it seems my "noise sensibilities" have not been totally wrong. But more importantly I will turn off the battery again when the engine is cold, turn it on again, start the car and let it run for 10 minutes and then start and drive off to see if everything works fine again like this morning. Then I will not turn the battery off anymore until wintertime (just plug it on the battery loader). I guess I learned about that.....its not a Daytona with no electronics....!
Besides I will go to the F-dealer to check with the electronic tester if anything is aligned correctly.

Long story....any thought about it from out there.....Terry, Brian ?
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post #17 of 26 Old 05-28-2012, 09:50 AM
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212- Brian had some people rag on him so have not seen him for a while. Hopefully he comes back soon. He says the disconnect switch is just for maintenance on the Motronic ECU cars and owners should leave the switch alone unless they really know what they are doing. The F50 uses Motronic 2.7, a system shared with late 348s, early F355s and early 456s. Later 355s, 456s, and 550s went to Motronic 5.2.

Whenever the battery disconnect switch is used, the Motronic ECU needs to relearn all the parameters that were erased out of memory by loss of power. In actual point of fact, you can ignore the relearn run cycle and there will be no ill affects. It will just take a while for everything to optimize and would not be a good idea to try and pass an emissions test until the car had been driven a while.

But if you want Motronic 2.7 to relearn as quickly as possible, these steps will help that along;

1. Ensure car is full cold before the relearn run cycle is started.
2. Turn off all accessories like the radio and the A/C
3. Insert the key into the ignition and wait 30 seconds in off.
4. Turn the key to on and wait 30 seconds.
5. Turn the key back to off and wait 30 seconds.
6. Turn the key to on, wait until the Check OK lamp illuminates and start the car.
7. Let the car idle for 10 minutes with no input whatsoever.
8. After 10 minutes, accessories can be turned back on.
9. Drive the car gently for about 10-20 minutes and everything should be back to normal.

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post #18 of 26 Old 05-28-2012, 10:01 AM
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I strongly recommend keeping the F50 on a battery conditioner whenever it is in the garage. I would also only use the battery disconnect switch when the car is being serviced. This has as much to do with the ECU as it does with the digital dash board display and making sure it remains in good health.
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post #19 of 26 Old 05-28-2012, 12:17 PM Thread Starter
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Terry, thanks so much for the recommondations by writing and by phone before !
Boxer, thanks so much for your comment, will not turn the Battery off anymore. Will do all the procedure as indicated by Terry tommorrow and report later !

Thank you again !
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post #20 of 26 Old 05-28-2012, 11:56 PM Thread Starter
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This mornin g I followed exactly Terry's procedure when starting the car. Went afterwards for a 30 minutes drive and everything runned beautifully and smooth. Will still go quick to the F-dealer to put the electronic device on. Thanks again for all help to all of you.
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