1981 308 GTSi engine removal - Ferrari Life
 
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post #1 of 16 Old 07-23-2004, 01:45 PM Thread Starter
 
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1981 308 GTSi engine removal

Our engine hoist and stand should be arriving next week, so we'll soon be ready to pull the motor out of the 308. I figure someone on here must have done this before, is there an established process for everything that must be removed or disconnected in order to remove the engine?
I mean besides the obvious fuel & coolant lines, motor mounts, etc.

Which would be the best bet, to disconnect the transmission or to pull the engine and tranny out as a unit?
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post #2 of 16 Old 07-23-2004, 02:09 PM
 
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I believe the engine and trany comes out as one unit. Top side that is. You'll have ot angle (tilt) the engine/trany one way or the other in order to get it out though. So, I remember reading. I've never done it myself. Have plenty of blankets to protect the body work. Of course the engine lid comes off before all this takes place.

I can't wait for your info on the pull and rebuild. I wish I could help you!
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post #3 of 16 Old 07-23-2004, 07:07 PM
 
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I believe that you may already have this site from your initial post, but it may help you with some of what you need to prepare for:

http://home.att.net/~ferrari/rebuild.htm

By the way, did you complete the removal of the oil pan? If so, what did you find ...

Best wishes
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post #4 of 16 Old 07-24-2004, 06:46 AM Thread Starter
 
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Partially. I removed all the retaining nuts for the oil pan, but this only allowed it to drop about 4 inches before hanging up on what I think is the geatshift linkage, which passes through the oil sump. From my research I've learned that the trick seems to be to remove the dipstick tube and the oil temp. sending unit, that allows you to move the oil pan cover a little more and get the right angle to remove it completely. What I've had trouble finding out is the exact sizes of the tube and sending unit. I'm pretty sure the tube is 27mm. Once we find out the size of the sensor we've just got to get the appropriate wrenches, since the biggest I have is 18mm.
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post #5 of 16 Old 07-24-2004, 12:29 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cls12vg30
What I've had trouble finding out is the exact sizes of the tube and sending unit. I'm pretty sure the tube is 27mm. Once we find out the size of the sensor we've just got to get the appropriate wrenches, since the biggest I have is 18mm.
When I don't have a particular wrench I check with the local Harbor Freight store... They ususally have a good selection and at reasonable prices.

You should have a Harbor Freight store at 3302 Capital Blvd. in Raleigh NC: phone 919-876-2023

If you have a good selection of SAE wrenches: If my math is correct

19mm = .74803 inches so try a 3/4" open end for the 19mm if it does't fit tight on the sensor,you may not wish to use the 3/4" if the sensor is really tight

27mm = 1.06299 inches so try a 1 and 1/16" open end wrench for the 27mm if it doesn't fit tight on the joint of the tube, you may not wish to use the 1 and 1/16' if the joint is really tight.

Keep us posted with your progress

Best wishes
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post #6 of 16 Old 07-27-2004, 07:37 AM Thread Starter
 
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Update: Last night, after trying to get at the dipstick tube retaining nut with a big 27mm wrench, and still not being able to get a grip on it, we decided to quit wasting our time trying to get the pan off with the motor still in the car and just start getting ready for the engine pull. The hoist has arrived and the stand will arrive shortly.
Next steps are:
-to label all wires, hoses, etc. that will be disconnected
- Drain engine coolant (anybody know how much it takes so I know how much to expect to come out?)
- remove airbox, airflow meter, coolant reservoir, and that thing next to the airbox that looks like a distributor cap but obviously handles fuel distribution in some manner. Does anyone know what that thing is called and exactly how it works? It seems like the actual fuel injection happens there and the fuel lines run from there to the injection ports? I've never seen a system like that before.
As for the airbox, of course removing the top half was no problem, but how do you detach the bottom half from the airflow meter? Also, is there an airflow meter upgrade for the 308 GTSi? I see that it uses a "flap-" or "trap-door"-type airflow meter, which is pretty crappy if you ask me? Is there any way to switch it to a hot wire-type MAF?
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post #7 of 16 Old 07-27-2004, 09:32 AM
 
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Here's how your fuel injection system works:
http://www.auto-solve.com/mech_inj.htm
The part you're refering to is the Fuel Distribution Unit. Be careful it's under a lot of pressure.

The air flow meter is an old trap door style. I have the same type on my MR2 Turbo. But we don't start to switch it out until we start to push over 350rwhp (400hp). So, while yes it's not as efficient as a MAF the $1000 or more you'd need to spend to update it wouldn't be worth the HP increase it brings. For that money I'd switch it over to electronic ignition. And for real HP move it to Electronic injection. Or port and polish, or better extrude hone, the intakes while you have the engine apart. Headers on the exhaust. After all that if you still want more power swap out the air flow meter. The cost benefit analysis on it doesn't really make too much sense otherwise.
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post #8 of 16 Old 07-27-2004, 11:04 AM Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for the info. That's funny, last night I was saying that thing was probably called the fuel distribution unit or something like that. I guess I was right on. So, mechanical fuel injection. That's something I've never dealt with before. This project just gets more and more interesting.
This particular 308 has already had the electronic ignition bank installed. We'l just leave the MAF alone I imagine.
As for the tiny steel fuel lines running from the distribution unit to the injectors, if we decide that some of all of those need to be replaced, is their anything special about them? Or will we be able to just locate some steel line of the correct diameter and do the appropriate bending?
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post #9 of 16 Old 07-27-2004, 11:09 AM
 
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That I don't know. I would assume since it's a Bosh unit replacemet parts shouldn't be that hard or expensive to find.
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post #10 of 16 Old 07-27-2004, 11:14 AM Thread Starter
 
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Another question. I can imagine the kind of fuel pressure we're dealing with here, despite the fact that the car has not been run in about eight months. Normally before working on a fuel injection system I would depressurize it by disconnecting the fuel pump relay and running the engine until it died, then cranking it over a few times. But in this case starting the engine is impossible. So, we are probably going to just have to carefully crack open some part of the fuel system and deal with the pressure. So, does anyone have a suggestion as to what point in the system would be the smartest and safest to open up first? Preferably a location where any fuel spray will be roughly in only one direction, and we can direct the spray into a container?
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post #11 of 16 Old 07-27-2004, 01:14 PM
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Start with the line coming from the fuel pump. Break it loose then wrap a rag around it the best you can and continue loosening it. Then work your way through the injectors. You may not have much pressure after 8 months.

Set up a box fan and blow plenty of air through the area so no fumes accumilate anywhere. Put out pilot lights on gas appliances like hot water heaters etc...............

SPASSO
308 V-12 Conversion click here.
"Oh yes, that is one of the very best ways to break these and it is also pretty dangerous. You really shouldn't do that". - mk e.
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post #12 of 16 Old 07-27-2004, 01:19 PM
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Lift the engine and transmission together. I have seen large nylon straps used. Adjust your hook towards the front of the car, above the forward bank of cyllinders. Lift from there and let the transmission dangle. It should come right out.

SPASSO
308 V-12 Conversion click here.
"Oh yes, that is one of the very best ways to break these and it is also pretty dangerous. You really shouldn't do that". - mk e.
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post #13 of 16 Old 07-27-2004, 05:24 PM Thread Starter
 
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Great advice, Spasso, thanks very much. We actually have a load leveler for the engine hoist, so we'll have two hooks to work with when that time comes. The straps sound like a great idea, do they market them for this specific purpose?

I sort of figured after eight months there wouldn't be much fuel pressure left, but you can't be too careful.
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post #14 of 16 Old 07-29-2004, 11:37 AM
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I have seen nylon tie-down straps at auto parts and hardware stores. Check a tool and implement catalogue too. These usually have a hook on each end with a ratchet attachment for cinching down loads on pick-up trucks. I use them for strapping down motorcycles etc.........

I have a set rated at only 300 lbs each strap, 20.00 USD. Get a higher rated set that will handle at least 1200 lbs together (600 lbs each) as a safety factor. Use two to do the lift.

SPASSO
308 V-12 Conversion click here.
"Oh yes, that is one of the very best ways to break these and it is also pretty dangerous. You really shouldn't do that". - mk e.
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post #15 of 16 Old 08-03-2004, 08:09 PM Thread Starter
 
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Can somebody tell me the location of the fuel pump on the 308?
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post #16 of 16 Old 08-04-2004, 09:40 AM
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Take the left rear wheel off and the inner fender out if you haven't already. Look forward of the wheel opening. The fuel pump should be at the bottom, aft side of the L/H fuel tank unless they moved it for the injected model.

SPASSO
308 V-12 Conversion click here.
"Oh yes, that is one of the very best ways to break these and it is also pretty dangerous. You really shouldn't do that". - mk e.
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