308 Intro and dilemma on 308 Useability - Ferrari Life
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post #1 of 23 Old 04-08-2013, 03:02 PM Thread Starter
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Intro and dilemma on 308 Useability

Hi, I'm effectively new to the forum after a 5 year gap in Ferrari ownership.

In a dilemma - have my heart set on an early 308 B but head is saying 328 for day to day reliability. I have other cars so don't need to use it daily but need it to be reliable when I do and not spend more time in the garage than on the road.

Love the clean lines of the 70's carb cars but several people have tried to steer me towards a 328 as an easier ownership proposition and I think I'm wobbling... Would really appreciate thoughts on whether I'm being unrealistic using a 308 regularly and the pitfalls of doing so (out of all my cars the one that gets driven most is my 70's Series3 Landy so I'm used to niggles).

Also, should I get an inspection done if I buy from the likes of foskers, rardleys, nick cartwright etc or am I wasting money?

Thanks for any help, first venture into vintage ferrari ownership so all opinions most welcome.
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post #2 of 23 Old 04-08-2013, 03:15 PM
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James- Welcome. They made 308s with carbs and single distributor electronic ignition and they were very reliable, but early 308s tend to rust very easily. Had a Euro 78 GTS a long time ago. Ran like a top, but after only three years, the door panels rusted through (in the UK). 328s do not have rust problems, in general, because in the 83/84 timeframe, Ferrari began a rustproofing system that was very effective.

If you can find one that someone has restored and rustproofed, Webers are very reliable once set up properly. The latest car you are discussing, a 328, was made in 1989, so having an independent PPI is very important. Some of those cars will be consignments, and the dealer is not going to spend a shilling on one of those unless forced.

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Last edited by tazandjan; 04-10-2013 at 03:54 PM.
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post #3 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 12:40 AM Thread Starter
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That's very useful, thanks.

Q. Did they galvanise the QV cars?

I seem to be getting conflicting views, leading me to believe it was rather hit and miss on this front. I guess an ideal compromise would be a galvanised QV car.
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post #4 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 04:37 AM
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Yes the QVs were galvanized starting in 84. 83s were not. 328s aren't usually prone to rust but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. FOW had an 88 for sale on their showroom with rusted/bubbled rocker panels under what looked to be a factory finish. Caveat Emptor!

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post #5 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 12:41 PM Thread Starter
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That's really helpful thanks - it's narrowed it down to a late QV, which I'm hoping still have the lovely 70's switchgear - I'm hoping that when they started galvanising, they didn't also make the change to the plastic swicthgear (my understanding is that some of the late QV's had the 328 style switches in the centre console, if anyone knows?)

Cheers,

James.
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post #6 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 03:23 PM
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James- The person who would probably know that kind of detail is Brian Crall, who is writing a book on the 308/328. You can go to ferraridatabase.com and download some owners manuals and perhaps, but probably not, see if there is any difference in the switchgear. At least you will have the OMs and the 308/328 workshop manual.

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post #7 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 07:50 PM
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Never seen a qv with anything other than toggle levers which are cable controlled for ventilation. Electrical contacts for fan speed, wiper speed and defroster. No push buttons in a QV.

Current: 85' GTS QV
It's a simple process...... it's just complicated by human beings....
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post #8 of 23 Old 04-10-2013, 02:13 PM Thread Starter
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Perfect - seems like no brainer on a later (galvanised) QV (or a carb if it's been fully rustproofed). Then some 14" wheels and period rubber to finish off.

Thinking 35-40 for a really nice one? Nothing on the Market right now (a few GTS, no B's), will try and be patient.

Thanks for all the help, really useful narrowing it down.

James.
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post #9 of 23 Old 04-10-2013, 03:08 PM
 
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Hi James,

I don't think I would be much help with your 308/328 decision since my knowledge is extremely limited regarding Ferrari's but I would love to see a photo of your Land Rover.
I am currently working on a 1966 Land Rover Dormobile, and within the next few years intend on pursing a early carb 308.

I am not sure if it is appropriate to get off topic, if so I apologize in advance.

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post #10 of 23 Old 04-10-2013, 03:57 PM
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James- No, you do not want 14" wheels, you want the 16" wheels that were optional on the 308. I had them on my 308 GTS from the factory. 14 x 7.5" wheels F&R were also optional, but the 7Jx16 F, 8Jx16 R wheels fitted with Pirelli P Zeros were the hot set-up. Photo of my 78 GTS taken in about 1981/2 in the UK. Factory deep front spoiler, four outlet exhaust (all QVs have that, IIRC), and 16" wheels.
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post #11 of 23 Old 04-15-2013, 12:30 PM
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They didn't deliver any QVs with 14 inch rims that i know of. You had two choices 390 metric (15.3 inch rim) with michelin TRX or 16 inches with either Pirelli P7 or Goodyear NCTs. If you find one with the TRX wheel option do yourself a favor and take them off.... Put them aside and go grab a set of 16 inch reproductions from Superformance. The TRX wasn't very good when they were new and now they're still no good and just silly expensive.

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post #12 of 23 Old 05-19-2013, 03:49 AM
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WARNING--THIS IS JUST MY OPINION SO TAKE IT WITH WHAT YOU PAID FOR IT

It's a toy, not transportation. Buy the car you want. Do not compromise because of what someone tells you about reliability. My experience is that carbs, once properly set up, are just as reliable (maybe more so) than the Bosch mechanical injection. Carbs are simple and robust. They don't typically "break." The Bosch has a lot of parts that all have to work right and they are notoriously hard for someone without the specific Bosch tools to troubleshoot and adjust. And when K-jet breaks, the parts are crazy money.

The carb cars sound better than the injected ones, and have much better throttle response than the injected ones. But they also are harder to make run "clean" (they smell) and get worse gas mileage. But if you want the old school carb Ferrari experience, an early 308 rocks. And if you care about fuel economy, you are buying the wrong car!!

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post #13 of 23 Old 05-19-2013, 06:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Birdman View Post
WARNING--THIS IS JUST MY OPINION SO TAKE IT WITH WHAT YOU PAID FOR IT

It's a toy, not transportation. Buy the car you want. Do not compromise because of what someone tells you about reliability. My experience is that carbs, once properly set up, are just as reliable (maybe more so) than the Bosch mechanical injection. Carbs are simple and robust. They don't typically "break." The Bosch has a lot of parts that all have to work right and they are notoriously hard for someone without the specific Bosch tools to troubleshoot and adjust. And when K-jet breaks, the parts are crazy money.

The carb cars sound better than the injected ones, and have much better throttle response than the injected ones. But they also are harder to make run "clean" (they smell) and get worse gas mileage. But if you want the old school carb Ferrari experience, an early 308 rocks. And if you care about fuel economy, you are buying the wrong car!!


w/ smiles

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post #14 of 23 Old 05-19-2013, 09:17 PM
 
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For what it's worth, I wrestled with the same dilemma for the longest time. Ultimately, I bought a 308 because I, too, truly love the look (particularly the interior) compared to the 328.

The reality is that neither 308 or 328 is competitive with modern sports cars. They have to be enjoyed within the context of a vintage performance envelope. But boy oh boy, is there a lot to enjoy. For my interests at least, the "higher performance" argument was not material.

1983 308 GTS Quattrovalvole
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post #15 of 23 Old 05-19-2013, 10:10 PM
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For rust issues, find a vetroresina!

They're more expensive but you will get lovely carbs, dry sump, light weight and no rust.

Here's mine with the exterior mimicking a Group 4 Rallye 308.
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post #16 of 23 Old 05-20-2013, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Birdman View Post
WARNING--THIS IS JUST MY OPINION SO TAKE IT WITH WHAT YOU PAID FOR IT

It's a toy, not transportation. Buy the car you want. Do not compromise because of what someone tells you about reliability. My experience is that carbs, once properly set up, are just as reliable (maybe more so) than the Bosch mechanical injection. Carbs are simple and robust. They don't typically "break." The Bosch has a lot of parts that all have to work right and they are notoriously hard for someone without the specific Bosch tools to troubleshoot and adjust. And when K-jet breaks, the parts are crazy money.

The carb cars sound better than the injected ones, and have much better throttle response than the injected ones. But they also are harder to make run "clean" (they smell) and get worse gas mileage. But if you want the old school carb Ferrari experience, an early 308 rocks. And if you care about fuel economy, you are buying the wrong car!!
What he said...and full disclosure coming; I own both a carbed and fuel injected Ferrari.

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post #17 of 23 Old 05-20-2013, 09:33 AM
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Capo- The chassis still rusts on the glass cars, but that is not a big issue and easier to permanently rustproof.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
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post #18 of 23 Old 05-20-2013, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
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Capo- The chassis still rusts on the glass cars, but that is not a big issue and easier to permanently rustproof.
Agree, much easier to control rust on the chassis members than on body panels and hidden sheet metal structure.

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post #19 of 23 Old 05-23-2013, 11:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Birdman View Post
WARNING--THIS IS JUST MY OPINION SO TAKE IT WITH WHAT YOU PAID FOR IT

It's a toy, not transportation. Buy the car you want. Do not compromise because of what someone tells you about reliability. My experience is that carbs, once properly set up, are just as reliable (maybe more so) than the Bosch mechanical injection. Carbs are simple and robust. They don't typically "break." The Bosch has a lot of parts that all have to work right and they are notoriously hard for someone without the specific Bosch tools to troubleshoot and adjust. And when K-jet breaks, the parts are crazy money.

The carb cars sound better than the injected ones, and have much better throttle response than the injected ones. But they also are harder to make run "clean" (they smell) and get worse gas mileage. But if you want the old school carb Ferrari experience, an early 308 rocks. And if you care about fuel economy, you are buying the wrong car!!
Spot on.
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post #20 of 23 Old 05-24-2013, 08:18 AM
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Atually, the best advice is to buy the best one you can find, even if it does not meet all your criteria. Having a reliable toy is more important than matching a list of wants with a car that needs a lot of work and attention.

Taz
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Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
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