500 Mondial Series 2 - Page 7 - Ferrari Life
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post #121 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 01:22 PM
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How cool! Thanks for posting, and I'm sure it will help others out there.

I must also comment on how cool it is that son and dad have such a great relationship centered around this wonderful car. It doesn't happen all that often that generations get to share their passions in this way. You are lucky people.


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post #122 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 01:30 PM Thread Starter
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Dear Terry,

Re the lantern clocks, are they originals or do you build them? And since we were talking about springs I presume the only springs they have are the bell hammer ones.

For sure the sounds they make are vey different from the little blue car.

ooops this was Tuesday and you missed the meeting!!!

Best regards,

Robert

Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018
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post #123 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 01:36 PM Thread Starter
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The next few shots are of the motor after it was mostly assembled and before we started it up for the first time since 1968. Best I can tell we are looking at about 384 pounds.

Best regards,
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Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018
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post #124 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 01:44 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy Chen Shiba DDS View Post
Ingenuity at it's best !!! Splendid endeavor. Thanx for showing and sharing, Admiral. w/ smiles Jimmy
Dear Jimmy,

Thanks, and take care - Typhoon Roke does not look good.

Best regards,

Robert

Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018
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post #125 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 01:48 PM
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Admiral- They are all original and three of them have restored wheel balances from before the pendulum was invented (or perfected) in 1657 by Huygens. Affirmative on the hammer springs, several of which have hammer stops that are works of art. The wheel balance clocks all have hollow weights so you can add or subtract weight to regulate.

Sounds like you might know a bit about clocks, too.

Taz
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post #126 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 01:53 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by JazzyO View Post
I must also comment on how cool it is that son and dad have such a great relationship centered around this wonderful car. It doesn't happen all that often that generations get to share their passions in this way. You are lucky people.

Onno
Dear Onno,

I fully agree about the generational relationship and it has not been about just this car. We have worked together on a Lotus Europa, MGBGT, Triumph Stag, MGA, the 500 Mondial and his 365 GT 2+2. But sad to say, he has fallen off the Ferrari wagon and has a new project car in the form of a 1965 Alfa Romeo Guila Sprint Speciale.

I don't understand that because as I recall history Enzo moved forward from Alfas to Ferrari, not the other way around. Guess I will not understand this generation.

Best regards,
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Robert

Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018
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post #127 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 02:06 PM
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Admiral- I remember my brother's 1300 Guilietta Sprint burning to the waterline just after restoration, so hope he has better luck. It back-fired through the carbs, and the air cleaners did little to tame the backfire. Whoosh.

Incidentally, my family were all car freaks, just not with quite as rarified a group of cars as you and your son. i thought I was lucky I learned how to drive on a 61 Corvette. Your son, however....

Taz
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post #128 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Admiral Goodwrench View Post
Dear Jimmy,

Thanks, and take care - Typhoon Roke does not look good.

Best regards,
Thank You, Admrial. There's so many typhoons one after another. Over here (Japan), we do not coin names but instead call them by sequential numbers. There are two typhoons right now, number 16 missed this tiny island but number 15 is hitting straight on, just like from your toe to head. Right now, it is doing much damage to southern part of Japan and in several hours should be above us. I was supposed to be on plane to LA in 18 hours, but has been delayed 16 hours more. Sorry to have went of the topic. Now back to the main thread. w/ smiles Jimmy

Last edited by Italian Lover; 09-20-2011 at 02:26 PM. Reason: spelling correction
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post #129 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 02:29 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tazandjan View Post
Admiral- They are all original and three of them have restored wheel balances from before the pendulum was invented (or perfected) in 1657 by Huygens.

Sounds like you might know a bit about clocks, too.
Dear Terry

I have long marveled at the kind of mind that Huygens had. Besides that he spoke dutch!

My clock knowledge is quite thin.

Best regards,

Robert

Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018
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post #130 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 02:57 PM Thread Starter
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These two fall closer to the category of art.

The first was turned from billet and carries the serial number 41.

The second picture was the view that grabbed my attention when I saw the Mondial for the very first time when I grabbed the rag from the shop floor and wiped it across the filthy grimy valve cover simply to find out what motor it was. That was the beginning of this story in 1960.

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post #131 of 796 Old 09-20-2011, 03:42 PM
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Admiral- Amazing what you can find by simply removing a bit of grime. That rag may have been the best, and least expensive, investment you ever made. Personally and financially.

If we had only known what all those vintage Ferraris would be worth, we would be up there with Buffett. Except we would not be telling Obama to tax us more.

Taz
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post #132 of 796 Old 09-22-2011, 10:47 AM
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Admiral, Bryan- I was looking through the 500/750 Mondial/Monza owners manual and it is amazing how much they packed into 25 pages.

But I really cracked up at some of the early translations. For carburetion: "- to enrich the mixture, unscrew!- to impoverish it, screw up!"
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File Type: pdf 500 Mondial 750 Monza.pdf (1.49 MB, 392 views)

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post #133 of 796 Old 09-22-2011, 10:54 AM
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post #134 of 796 Old 09-22-2011, 11:34 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tazandjan View Post
Admiral, Bryan- I was looking through the 500/750 Mondial/Monza owners manual and it is amazing how much they packed into 25 pages.

But I really cracked up at some of the early translations. For carburetion: "- to enrich the mixture, unscrew!- to impoverish it, screw up!"
Dear Terry,

We too have laughed at the "screw up" guidance. I use the word guidance with a big caution. Yes this is the factory guidance but beware. On page 14 shown below is the note about the four notch locking ring being a left handed thread. I carefully made a notched socket to fit that ring. Then using a big breaker bar we proceeded to destroy the socket attempting to loosen the nut by turning clockwise. Made another and this time tried loosening by turning counterclockwise and it worked. So much for factory guidance! It was not made any easier by being down inside the front timing group casting. Photo also below.

Best regards,
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Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018

Last edited by Admiral Goodwrench; 09-22-2011 at 11:44 AM.
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post #135 of 796 Old 09-22-2011, 11:36 AM Thread Starter
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i'm jealous of the high quality pics! must be ken!
Dear Ed,

Taken by my iPhone!










NOT!

Best regards,

Robert

Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018
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post #136 of 796 Old 09-22-2011, 01:33 PM
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Admiral- Brian Crall is always telling me not to trust the factory data until you have used it. That locking ring must have been pretty tight by the time you finished destroying the first socket. Luckily, sounds like no damage was done, except to the socket.

From the OM, there were a lot similarities, but also a lot of differnces between the 500 and 750. Wonder if the 750s used a left hand thread?

Taz
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post #137 of 796 Old 09-22-2011, 04:39 PM Thread Starter
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From the OM, there were a lot similarities, but also a lot of differnces between the 500 and 750. Wonder if the 750s used a left hand thread?
Dear Terry,

Actually the motors of the 500 (tipo 111) and the 750 (tipo 105 & 119) have a very high degree of commonality. The obvious differences are the crankshaft, liners, valves, carburetors and sometimes magnetos (vs distributors). The crankcase and the head castings are the same but machined slightly differently. I believe everything else in the motor including cams (sometimes), valve springs, oil pan, clutch and motor front gear train are identical.

Frankly if one cannot see the velocity stacks then the motors are externally indistinguishable. This is one of the reasons that tracing the early cars is so difficult as the factory in several instances exchanged motors of differing displacements in the same chassis.

Best regards,

Robert

Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018
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post #138 of 796 Old 09-24-2011, 08:39 AM Thread Starter
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Dear Terry,

Thanks to your thread on Baum tools I now know the proper name for the notched sockets I made for the 500 motor work. They apparently are properly called "grooved nut sockets". Who knew.

Best regards,

Robert

Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018
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post #139 of 796 Old 09-24-2011, 10:29 AM
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Admiral- Someone always posts something like that after you have already made the tool, naturally. Not sure one of those would have fit, at any rate.

Thanks for the 500/750 lesson. Those are definitly racing engines, through and through. Were the six cylinder engines similar?

Taz
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post #140 of 796 Old 09-30-2011, 04:19 PM Thread Starter
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Were the six cylinder engines similar?
Dear Terry,

Yes the six cylinder motors were of the same design only the last two cylinders in line were simply added to the front four - obviously needing another Weber, longer cams and cam boxes, cylinder head, crank, crankcase and pan.

Later on I will get into some of the intriguing parts of the valve train.

Best regards,

Robert

Robert

Past: 500 Mondial S2 0556(0446)/MD owned 58 years from June 1960 to August 2018
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