360 Headlights Question - Ferrari Life
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 12 Old 12-27-2014, 07:35 AM Thread Starter
Owner
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Greensboro
Ferrari Life Posts: 50
Headlights Question

I'm having an issue with my headlights on my 360. The lights turn on fine but after about 10 minutes the headlights start to flicker and after about 1 minute of this, they go out completely. I can turn on the high beams but after about 2 minutes, the same thing happens to them.

I made a 'quick and dirty' test apparatus to see if the problem was on the signal side of the relay or the power side of the relay. The problem appears to be on the signal side. I confirmed this by forcing the main beams on with a jumper wire and driving the car for 1/2 hour with no issues.

Does anyone out there have any ideas or experience as to the most likely culprit? I've checked the wiring diagram in the service manual which only marginally helped.

Happy New Years!

Jeff
JeffWilliams is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 12 Old 12-27-2014, 10:42 AM
Owner
 
netman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: SoCal
Ferrari Life Posts: 226
Garage
check the ground and connections. Have had some experience in the past with heat and expansion causing temporary disconnect.
netman is offline  
post #3 of 12 Old 12-28-2014, 02:10 PM Thread Starter
Owner
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Greensboro
Ferrari Life Posts: 50
Thanks, netman! I did a little more testing this morning and have it narrowed down to the signal circuit on the +15 services relay behind the drivers seat. This relay supplies the signal power for the headlight relays up front.

I've looked at the wiring diagram again. Ferrari saw fit to not publish the S172H splice connections. I guess I'll need to hunt it down and find out how many there are and where they all go.

Getting closer to a solution, though.

Jeff
JeffWilliams is offline  
 
post #4 of 12 Old 12-29-2014, 08:17 AM
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Seattle
Ferrari Life Posts: 66
Great job troubleshooting Jeff.

My thoughts are the same. Either relay going bad or lose connection.

Keep us posted please.

Thanks.

Dan
whatheheck is offline  
post #5 of 12 Old 12-30-2014, 10:26 AM
Owner
 
netman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: SoCal
Ferrari Life Posts: 226
Garage
Contact Glen at AMH Exotics. He has some great connections for parts and diagrams.
netman is offline  
post #6 of 12 Old 01-04-2015, 01:59 PM Thread Starter
Owner
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Greensboro
Ferrari Life Posts: 50
OK, so I spent today disassembling the wiring harness stuff and I'm still stumped. All the splices, connections, and wires appear to be in good order. The relay is new and still after ten minutes, it's all chatter.

One thing that has me confused is the negative side signal to the services relay. The wire is also the power for the starter motor soleniod. (Honest, I checked it physically) It's as if the starter solenoid acts as a ground when the starter motor is not being used to start the car. Can someone confirm this? There is a lot to be gained if this is the case since I've also had an intermittent 'no start' issue when the car is at full temperature.

Jeff
JeffWilliams is offline  
post #7 of 12 Old 01-12-2015, 08:00 AM Thread Starter
Owner
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Greensboro
Ferrari Life Posts: 50
Got It Solved!

OK, for those who are interested, I finally got this intermittent headlight issue solved.

Up to this point, I had figured out where the problem was (ground signal +15 services relay) but not why. My last point to check was the starter itself. This serves as the ground for the +15 services relay when you're not using the starter motor.

When I got to the starter, I was shocked to see that of the three structural fasteners that should have been holding the starter to the eng/trans assembly, only one was there. This single nut was not even finger tight.

I pulled the starter off anyway to check the internals. I resoldered the solenoid coil leads on principle and installed the starter with all the hardware. Problem solved.

Thanks for the encouragement from everyone.

Jeff
JeffWilliams is offline  
post #8 of 12 Old 01-12-2015, 12:32 PM
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Ferrari Life Posts: 18
Grounding problem

Jeff,
You DIY guys amaze me. Nice work tracking the problem down and sharing your wisdom to the other DIY folks. Very impressive.
Don
anconbrat is offline  
post #9 of 12 Old 01-12-2015, 02:16 PM
Owner
Elite Member
 
tazandjan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Ferrari Life Posts: 11,859
Jeff- Good sleuthing. At least you got it before it tore up your flywheel.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
tazandjan is online now  
post #10 of 12 Old 01-13-2015, 08:52 AM Thread Starter
Owner
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Greensboro
Ferrari Life Posts: 50
Thanks, Taz and anconbrat. This has been gnawing at me for a little while and I just couldn't stand having a functional issue. Call it obsessive if you please, but I HAD to fix this.

Jeff
JeffWilliams is offline  
post #11 of 12 Old 01-14-2015, 07:13 AM
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Triad Area NC
Ferrari Life Posts: 33
Ferrari really uses some silly functionality. This is on par with sensing the brake light circuit to allow the F1 transmission to go into gear instead of using a second contact on the brake light switch -- really stupid.
Alan
English Rebel is offline  
post #12 of 12 Old 01-18-2015, 05:26 AM Thread Starter
Owner
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Greensboro
Ferrari Life Posts: 50
I'm trying to be positive about this experience. The design is clever in the simplicity. By connecting things this way, you force as much power to the starting of the car as you can. (The lights and cooling fans are forced off during start up) However, if you don't expect the systems to be interconnected it can be a bugger.

The other positive is that I believe my intermittent hot 'no start' issue may also be solved. I wouldn't have gotten to find that if Ferrari had done things some other way.

OK, enough of this cheerful crap. Now I've got to put together a PowerPoint to explain to the guys that serviced my car why they owe me the cost of the light bulbs they put in my car to 'solve' the problem.
JeffWilliams is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome
Copyright 2012 ONE Media, Inc.
FerrariLife is independently run with no affiliation with Ferrari SpA
Ferrari for Sale | Maserati for Sale