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-   -   F430 LED Tail Lights Comparison and Review (https://www.ferrarilife.com/forums/modern-v8s-360-f430/16267-led-tail-lights-comparison.html)

StefVan 01-20-2012 11:39 AM

LED Tail Lights Comparison and Review
 
As I transformed my tail lights in such way that they work all 4 together in position light or brake light (all 8 halves), I had to reduce the current drained of 8 x 5W/21W light bulbs. It is impossible to power 168W (up to a theoretic 14 Amp) with the existing wire harnesses and fuses.


That’s how I started my research several months ago in hope to find the best LED light. The objective was to resolve 2 main issues with incandescent light bulbs :
  • important power consumption and current drain
  • high level of permanent heat in position (5W) and extreme heat in brake (21W)
  • short life time
The problem is that I wanted the LED’s to be at least as bright as the incandescent light bulbs. And that’s a real challenge especially if you want to keep the power consumption and heat at the lowest level. They must be also fit the tail lights which is quite tight. They can’t be larger than the standard light bulbs but there is a margin in the length.


Here are all the details of the best LED’s I found. I eliminated many of them which are not ever worth to be mentioned. Unfortunately, most of the LED’s you can find online or on Ebay fall in this category. Despite the commercials announcing “The brightest LED” etc, in reality, they are totally useless, and are even dangerous to be used as brake/stop lights at daylight. Many cheap LED lights failed also on my test bench after being permanently powered during a couple of hours in the brake/stop light position. That was far from the often announced 50.000 hours life time.


The LED technology has been evolving a lot during these last years and will continue to do so. Today, we’re far away of the classical 5mm LED. Most of the LED bulbs use the SMD technology which is quite cheap, runs at a reasonable current and heat but are still limited in terms of brightness. Most of the LED bulbs uses SMD LED’s. Hyperflex LED’s provide a much higher level of brightness but will heat easily. High power LED’s deliver an intense level of brightness but must be cooled by a serious heat sink.


Most of the LED lights are setup to run at exactly 12V. The problem is that most of the cars with a running engine will deliver a minimum of 14.5V. That means that the LED’s will be overpowered and will fail prematurely. This was the case with several SMD LED’s which failed after a couple of hours. Only the High Power LED’s have an integrated current driver. A current driver will deliver exactly the right current needed by the LED’s whatever the voltage is. Thus, they will never be overpowered.


All tested LED lights are standard dual contact S25/1157/BAY15D bulbs having a 15mm bayonet base. It’s essential that the bulbs have side LED’s in addition to the front LED’s to light up the entire tail light.


I truly tested the following LED’s during long periods of time. A couple of them failed immediately when shipped but have been replaced by the seller.


To compare the LED light brightness and effect with traditional 5/12 light bulbs, I took a picture of each of them under identical ambient light conditions. The left half of the taillight contains a 5/12 incandescent light bulb while the right half contains the tested LED light. It’s quite challenging to take a picture comparing both lights as a camera will flatten the light difference. The light difference in the pictures must be interpreted by at least doubling the difference you can observe to get closer to the real difference.


I measured also the maximum operation temperature reached after 2 minutes lighting up the position and stop lights with an ambient temperature of 17.4C / 63.3F. This measurement is important to know because it will tell how much heat the plastic tail light will have to deal with. This is especially the case when in some countries you have to use permanently the position lights as well as the time the stop lights will be used in traffic jams or at traffic lights (especially F1 cars).


Of course, such LED’s can not only be used on the F430 but in theory on any older Ferrari having the incandescent light bulbs.

StefVan 01-20-2012 11:43 AM

Incandescent light bulb
 
1 Attachment(s)
Incandescent light bulb

Attachment 40308

Number of LEDs : N/A
Front LEDs : N/A
Side LEDs : N/A
LED colour : N/A
Length : 45,8mm
Width Top : 26mm
Voltage : 12V
Power : 5 W / 21W
Current : 416mA / 1750mA
Approx price per bulb : 1$
Max Temperature position light : 180C / 356F
Max Temperature stop light : 107C / 225F

Comments : difficult to beat a filament light bulb with LEDs in terms of brightness and filling up the entire tail light with light. But such bulbs really do heat a lot and have a high power consumption. The power consumption will vary as well as the heat because the filament resistance has a tendency to change with time. They have also a limited life time which will be even shorten when switched on/off very often. I measured also a real current which was well higher than 1.7A and was closer to 1.9A.

StefVan 01-20-2012 11:48 AM

Led 1 : 1157 BAY15D 36-LED LIGHT BULB
 
2 Attachment(s)
Led 1 : 1157 BAY15D 36-LED LIGHT BULB

Attachment 40309


Number of LEDs : 36
Front LEDs : 9
Side LEDs : 27
LED colour : cold white (exists in red also)
Length : 45,8mm
Width Top : 26mm
Voltage : 12V 14.8V
Power : 2.7W
Current : 225mA
Approx price per bulb : 4$
Max Temperature position light : 17.4C / 63.3F
Max Temperature stop light : 36.5C / 97.7F


Attachment 40310


Comments: This is a very reliable, cheap and low power LED light which can be universally found. This is the light I initially installed in my tail lights and they never failed. It supports also a higher voltage. Although, they are not bright enough at daylight as you can see in the picture comparison test. Even if the light fills up the entire tail light, the difference in brightness with an incandescent light bulb is important, especially the stop light. These lights will also require an addition resistor for the F1 cars as the power consumption is too low (add 100 Ohm). Without such resistor, you may have troubles to get into gear or get to neutral (credits to Anders for finding this out ;) ).

StefVan 01-20-2012 11:51 AM

Led 2 : 1157 WHITE 102 LED LIGHT BULB
 
2 Attachment(s)
Led 2 : 1157 WHITE 102 LED LIGHT BULB

Attachment 40311

Number of LEDs : 102 SMD
Front LEDs : 12
Side LEDs : 90 (18x5 sides)
LED colour : bright white (6000K)
Length : 57mm
Width Top : 20mm
Voltage : 12V 14.8V
Power : 4.5W
Current : 375mA
Approx price per bulb : 12$
Max Temperature position light : 24.7C / 76.5F
Max Temperature stop light : 62.5C / 144.5F


Attachment 40312


Comments: This is the brightest traditional SMD LED light I have tested. It is given for 408Lum which is not bad. The ad equation of power consumption/brightness is quite good. Although, it is still not as bright as a 5/21 bulb. The high level of brightness in addition to the 6000K colour range gives a yellowish/orange colour result once inside the tail light. Without a heat sink, such light is heating quite a bit.

StefVan 01-20-2012 11:55 AM

Led 3 : CREE Q5 5W 1157 Bay15d LED High Power Light
 
2 Attachment(s)
Led 3 : CREE Q5 5W 1157 Bay15d LED High Power Light with projector lens

Attachment 40313

Number of LED’s : 1 Cree Q5 High Power LED
Front LED’s : 1
Side LED’s : 0
LED colour : bright white (exists also in red)
Length : 52mm
Width Top : 25mm
Voltage : 12V - 24V
Power : 5W
Current : 415mA
Approx price per bulb : 15$
Max Temperature position light : 19.5C / 67.1F
Max Temperature stop light : 42.1C / 107.8F



Attachment 40314


Comments: The High Power Cree Q5 LED is a very powerful LED used in different applications. It is given for 420Lum. The bulb integrates also a current driver in the base which will provide the right current to the LED whatever the input voltage is. High Power LED’s dissipate a lot of heat and they need a consistent heat sink. The red aluminium radiator around the LED is cooling the light in an efficient way. Although, despite the brightness of this light, the integrated lens projects the light in a very small angle through the tail light. I tried also a light with a diffuser lens but the results were identical. Such light isn’t appropriate for our tail lights as the light will be concentrated only in the centre and is not filling up the tail light. One light of the package I ordered didn’t work but has been replaced immediately by the seller. I still have doubts if this light is truly reliable because installed on my car, I was once followed by a friend who told me that the light brightness was permanently fading in and out between position and stop light. This light was a good try but I wouldn’t recommend it.

StefVan 01-20-2012 12:02 PM

Led 4 : CREE Q5 5W 1157 + 12SMD
 
2 Attachment(s)
Led 4 : CREE Q5 5W 1157 + 12SMD Bay15d LED High Power Light with projector lens

Attachment 40315

Number of LEDs : 1 Cree Q5 High Power LED
Front LEDs : 1 Q5
Side LEDs : 12 x 5050 SMD
LED colour : bright white
Length : 53mm
Width Top : 20mm
Voltage : 12V - 24V
Power : 7W
Current : 585mA
Approx price per bulb : 18$
Max Temperature position light : 18.2C / 64.8F
Max Temperature stop light : 78.3C / 172.9F

Attachment 40316

Comments: This light is using the same Cree Q5 LED and integrates also a current driver in the base. As LED 3, the brightness of this light is quite impressive. Grace to the side 5050 SMD LEDs, the light is less concentrated in the centre and light fills up also the area around the tail light. As a brake light, the brightness is quite good but still too much concentrated in the centre. Although in position, the brightness was deceiving. I found no technical issues with this light except that the small radiator isnt large enough (the available space is taken by the SMD LEDs). In brake, this light radiator is heating really a lot which would certainly reduce its overall life time. By the time Im writing this review, this light is now more difficult to find.

StefVan 01-20-2012 12:09 PM

Led 5 : 3W High Power Light with 320 reflector lens
 
3 Attachment(s)
Led 5 : 3W High Power Light with 320 reflector lens

Attachment 40318

Number of LEDs : 1 High Power 3W LED
Front LEDs : 1
Side LEDs : 0
LED colour : red and white
Length : 52mm
Width Top : 18mm
Voltage : 12V - 24V
Power : 3W
Current : 65mA / 240mA
Approx price per bulb : 13$
Max Temperature position light : 24.6C / 76.3F
Max Temperature stop light : 35.6C / 96.1F



RED
Attachment 40319

WHITE
Attachment 40320



Comments: If tested this light in two variants : red and white. The difference between both colours is very interesting. Even if the red colour is less bright in terms of Luminous Flux, the result inside the tail light gives a perfect deep red colour. You can see very well this difference between both sets of pictures. The Red LED light is brighter than the incandescent light bulb in position light and equals in stop light. It doesnt heat at all and has a power consumption of only 3W. The 320 reflector lens is very efficient and distributed the light quite well in the tail light. It integrates also a current driver. Now we getting close to the ideal solution!

StefVan 01-20-2012 12:12 PM

Led 6 : 6W High Power Light
 
2 Attachment(s)
Led 6 : 6W High Power Light

Attachment 40321

Number of LEDs : 8 High Power LEDs
Front LEDs : 2
Side LEDs : 6
LED colour : red
Length : 51mm
Width Top : 16mm
Voltage : 12V - 24V
Power : 6W
Current : 500mA
Approx price per bulb : 20$
Max Temperature position light : 22.1C / 71.8F
Max Temperature stop light : 33.4C / 92.1F




Attachment 40322




Comments: This LED light is a bit more expensive but delivers the most impressive results despite its very compact size. In position light as well as in stop light, it largely overpasses the brightness of an incandescent light bulb! The side LEDs do give a very deep red colour to the tail light and the result is really beautiful. It enhances the esthetical aspect of the tail lights and brings them to a new dimension. The picture doesnt show it very well but now its the incandescent light bulb that seems to be yellowish! The LEDs are very well integrated in a strong and efficient aluminium heat sink and is even nicely shaped. It does look very well manufactured when you have it in your hands. Of course, it integrates also a current driver. Will I be satisfied now with this perfect LED light ;)?

StefVan 01-20-2012 12:17 PM

Led 7 : 3W High Power Light with reflector lens
 
2 Attachment(s)
Led 7 : 3W High Power Light with reflector lens

Attachment 40323

Number of LEDs : 4 High Power LEDs
Front LEDs : 1
Side LEDs : 3
LED colour : red
Length : 44mm
Width Top : 25mm
Voltage : 12V
Power : 3W
Current : 250mA
Approx price per bulb : 6.5$
Max Temperature position light : 22.0C / 71.6F
Max Temperature stop light : 25.7C / 78.3F

Attachment 40324

Comments: This LED light is very cheap compared to its capacities which overpasses largely any classical LED light. The overall length is only 44mm which can be a little too short as it wont go deep enough in the tail light. Despite the short length, the brightness is excellent. As you can see on the picture, in position light, it is much brighter than an incandescent light. Although, the brake light is slightly less bright with a strong light point in the centre but less light around. It has a strong golden plated aluminium heat sink which is very efficient as it does not heat at all. It integrates also a current driver in the base. With a consumption of only 3W, this light is a very good economical choice.

StefVan 01-20-2012 12:36 PM

3 Attachment(s)
Now here are some pictures where I put all LED’s together in such way that they can be compared more easily ;)

Attachment 40325

Attachment 40326
Attachment 40327

430Addict 01-20-2012 09:11 PM

Completely blown away as always Stef!!! This is some crazy shit you've gone through. Sure you don't work for Ferrari?

Mo T 01-21-2012 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 430Addict (Post 173778)
Completely blown away as always Stef!!! This is some crazy shit you've gone through. Sure you don't work for Ferrari?

+1

Your an asset to the F430 community, thank you very much.

So conclusion is Led 6 : 6W High Power Light the best out of the lot?

StefVan 01-21-2012 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 430Addict (Post 173778)
Completely blown away as always Stef!!! This is some crazy shit you've gone through. Sure you don't work for Ferrari?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mo T (Post 173799)
+1

Your an asset to the F430 community, thank you very much.

So conclusion is Led 6 : 6W High Power Light the best out of the lot?

Thanks very much guys. Such test is worth doing because when you buy LED lights, whatever they advertise, once inside the tail light, the results can be very disappointing and a waste of money. It's only when you start comparing them that you'll see the differences and we want the best for ower Ferrari's :)

Led 6 is definitely the best. The other reason why I would choose Led 6 is that it has a higher power consumption of 6W. You may be surprised I'm saying that but for those who have F1 cars, a light having a too low power consumption may cause random issues with the F1 as Anders experienced when we did the LED 1 mod together, some time ago.

jgelovani 01-21-2012 01:23 PM

Nice study, idneed. Would you please indicate who is the manufacturer and where from it is possible to purchase the #6 LEDs.
Thanks.

Fiorano 01-21-2012 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 430Addict (Post 173778)
Completely blown away as always Stef!!! This is some crazy shit you've gone through. Sure you don't work for Ferrari?

+1. Your attention to detail and thoroughness is second to none.

Tio 01-21-2012 11:45 PM

This is an excellent research Stef!:thumbsup:

To be completely honest, this is extremely useful for me, because I was actually looking into replacing my standard light bulbs with LEDs.
I wasn't aware of the low voltage issue with F1 cars, this is very valuable information!!!
Yes, is it possible to let us know the source that we can order the number 6 light please?

Thanks again!

johan6504 01-22-2012 01:04 AM

Nice write up, thanks :-)

StefVan 01-22-2012 03:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tio (Post 173948)
This is an excellent research Stef!:thumbsup:

To be completely honest, this is extremely useful for me, because I was actually looking into replacing my standard light bulbs with LEDs.
I wasn't aware of the low voltage issue with F1 cars, this is very valuable information!!!
Yes, is it possible to let us know the source that we can order the number 6 light please?

Thanks again!

Thanks very much Harry ;). I found only one place where to get these 6W LED lights.

The seller "ac-rc" sells them on Ebay : Aquarium, Led Lamp Bulb items in ac-rc store on eBay!

I've exchanged many emails with the shop owner Alan and he's one of the best sellers I dealt with on Ebay or the Internet. Very fast replies, extremely helpful and very courteous.

The 6W LED lights can be found here :
2 x 1157 Red 6W Ultra Bright High Power LED Tail Brake Signal Light | eBay

Please keep in mind that it's now Chinese New Year so most of the shops and plants are closed.

Mo T 01-22-2012 04:34 AM

Stef, do you have Before & After pics of the car's rear end with these #6 lights?

StefVan 01-22-2012 07:49 AM

Not yet Mohammed, I'm waiting for the delivery of the remaining 6xLED lights as I initially ordered only 1 set of each tested LED light. I'll post some pics once I've installed all of them. But I will have to upgrade also my integrated wire harness relays (another DIY guide where all 4 tail lights are working together). The Reed relays won't be able to switch more than 5W while now I will have 2x6W. I'll make a separate thread on how to upgrade to Euro tail lights in such way that all 4 tail lights will work together (position and brake light) respecting the mandatory EURO fog rear lights (that's why we need a relay).

Mo T 01-23-2012 04:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StefVan (Post 174000)
Not yet Mohammed, I'm waiting for the delivery of the remaining 6xLED lights as I initially ordered only 1 set of each tested LED light. I'll post some pics once I've installed all of them. But I will have to upgrade also my integrated wire harness relays (another DIY guide where all 4 tail lights are working together). The Reed relays won't be able to switch more than 5W while now I will have 2x6W. I'll make a separate thread on how to upgrade to Euro tail lights in such way that all 4 tail lights will work together (position and brake light) respecting the mandatory EURO fog rear lights (that's why we need a relay).

4 tail lights working together would be incredible. Especially with the nice spread this #6 led has.

Looking forward to your further updates Stef :thumbsup:

Tio 01-23-2012 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StefVan (Post 173974)
Thanks very much Harry ;). I found only one place where to get these 6W LED lights.

The seller "ac-rc" sells them on Ebay : Aquarium, Led Lamp Bulb items in ac-rc store on eBay!

I've exchanged many emails with the shop owner Alan and he's one of the best sellers I dealt with on Ebay or the Internet. Very fast replies, extremely helpful and very courteous.

The 6W LED lights can be found here :
2 x 1157 Red 6W Ultra Bright High Power LED Tail Brake Signal Light | eBay

Please keep in mind that it's now Chinese New Year so most of the shops and plants are closed.

This is fantastic!

I will check them out now!

Thanks again!
:-)

StefVan 01-26-2012 08:47 AM

I received some good update from the seller of the LED #6 - 6W. They will upgrade their lights with 45mm high power LED chips which will make this light 50% more brighter but will operate with an identical temperature. I will let you know when they will be available and will test them out ;)

50hdmc 01-28-2012 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StefVan (Post 174864)
I received some good update from the seller of the LED #6 - 6W. They will upgrade their lights with 45mm high power LED chips which will make this light 50% more brighter but will operate with an identical temperature. I will let you know when they will be available and will test them out ;)

Very impressive indeed.....NICE work!

StefVan 03-03-2012 11:44 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Here's a picture with the results of the 6W LED Lights. There are extremely bright overpassing largely a normal incandescent light bulb. With all 8 halves illuminating all together, now the brake lights can be seen much better and from far away. In addition, such LED lights illuminate well faster than an incandescent light bulb.

These LED lights should last a mininum of 30.000 hours which is 3.5 years non-stop illuminated. That's well more than the life time of a car and I won't have to deal anymore with blown light bulbs ;)

sclja 03-21-2012 08:27 PM

led testing
 
Excellent write up... I would like to say that you honestly saved [email protected] $150 in parts and countless hours of time testing as I have done a couple of led complete make overs on cars and I have a 360 in my bay right now and my customer is interested in an leds.... I would like to offer something for your time! If you want to send me your email/ paypal I will contribute to your cause!

Scott LJA

StefVan 03-21-2012 10:35 PM

Hi Scott,
Thanks very much for your very honest wish to contribute, this is so rare today :) I'm glad this saved you some precious time in research and testing. I will PM you.

Please post us a picture of your clients LED taillight once you've done the job ;). And if you have any questions, don't hesitate to post them.

netman 03-22-2012 10:18 AM

Are these same bulbs applicable to the 360 F1 cars as well?

StefVan 03-22-2012 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by netman (Post 185414)
Are these same bulbs applicable to the 360 F1 cars as well?

Sure you can use them on any pre-458 Ferrari model.

StefVan 03-22-2012 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sclja (Post 185300)
Excellent write up... I would like to say that you honestly saved [email protected] $150 in parts and countless hours of time testing as I have done a couple of led complete make overs on cars and I have a 360 in my bay right now and my customer is interested in an leds.... I would like to offer something for your time! If you want to send me your email/ paypal I will contribute to your cause!

Scott LJA

Scott, I wanted to publically thank you for your contribution I received by Paypal! Im very flattered! :thumbsup:

StefVan 03-25-2012 11:53 AM

1 Attachment(s)
As I wrote in post #23, the 6W LED light has now been improved to a 7.5W (180mA) LED light containing now a 60 lens.

Although, there is warning saying that they shouldn't be used more than 15 minutes at full power to avoid overheating.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=220984738160

StefVan 03-28-2012 12:07 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Since the 6W LED lights have been replaced by the 7.5W LED lights, I got back in touch with the vendor in China to understand why these new LED lights are heating so much. They measured 65C after 30 minutes of operation which is the maximum the heat sink can cope with, so this LED light can't be used as a fog light for instance. Although, as a position/parking + stop light, it still should be fine but I haven't tested out.

The new 7.5W is based on the latest EPISTAR ES-LAHRPH24 chip which is a 24milx24mil (610um...) chip. It can deliver a luminous intensity of 3000mcd at 150mA! Very impressive.
The light has 3LED's x 4 faces + 3LED's on top behind the lens. That's a total of 15LED's.

Here's a picture comparing the recommended 6W to the 7.5W in stop light (highest brightness). As you can see, the brightness of the 7.5W is truly impressive knowing that the 6W was already at a very high level.
Attachment 43122

Microscopic view of the EPISTAR Chip
Attachment 43123

Despite the impressive 7.5W LED light, I've asked them if they can produce again the 6W LED lights. They are now building up a 6W prototype using the new LED chips and new housing and will send it to me for testing. At the end, both 7.5W and 6W will be available so that anyone can choose what suits best depending on their needs :) More to come ;)

StefVan 03-29-2012 08:42 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Here's another picture comparing the 6W with the 7.5W but this time in position/parking (reduced brightness).

In position/parking, the maximum measured temperature was 34C with an ambient temperature of 24.5C and after 1 hour non-stop operation time.

'Da Wolf 04-10-2012 07:21 AM

Hey mate nice to see you still adding untold value to the Ferrari world. So what would you recommend to go for? The red or white and 6 or 7.5?
How many bulbs in total will I need? Two for the white reverse and 6 red?
Also do you have Alan's email address I could have please.

Thanks

StefVan 04-10-2012 09:40 AM

Thanks very much buddy ;)

Without hesitation, I would consider only red LED lights for the parking/stop lights. As for the 2 reverse lights, if I'm not mistaken, on the 360, these are P21W bulbs (1156). I would take the white version for the reverse lights.

I don't know exactly how many P21/5W - 1157 bulbs you have on the US version of the 360. I would advise you to remove the bulb holders and check how many exactly you need. If someone knows this, please chime in.

You can reach Alan directly at [email protected]. Don't hesitate to reference me to have the best service. Alan is now working on the new 6W version because I asked him the produce them again. The latest 7.5W have a too high operation temperature and I can't advice them for our Ferraris. We had several exchanges to specify the new 6W LED lights and I should receive soon a first "Proof of Concept" which I will test and check. I will update as soon as I'm having some fresh update ;)

'Da Wolf 04-10-2012 05:04 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Hey mate, thanks for that my car is a Euro spec 360: Heres a pic of the light housing (borrowed from a friend).

Thanks

'Da Wolf 04-10-2012 05:07 PM

List of bulbs on the 360 from the manual
 
1 Attachment(s)
If anyones interested.

Tio 04-11-2012 01:47 AM

Hi Stef,

If you ever decide to make a led light package for the F430, I am interested.
I trust you more than I trust my self when it comes to making the right decisions
regarding any upgrade for our cars!
:)

trainwrex 04-12-2012 06:53 PM

Great workup stef.

How are these leds wired in? i will be looking at doing this for my stradale once it arrives in a couple of months.

StefVan 04-12-2012 10:12 PM

Thanks very much ;) and welcome to FerrariLife :)

The 1157 and 1156 LEDs are a direct replacement of the normal light bulbs. There is no rewiring needed ;)

On the 360 and CS, the parking/stop lights are 1157-21W5 light bulbs while the fog and turn lights are 1156- 21W only. If you change the turn lights for the LED version, you'll need to add a load resistor, otherwise, they will blink too fast.


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