550WSR cars deserves own registry category - Ferrari Life
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 18 Old 06-04-2016, 10:27 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Ferrari Life Posts: 3
550WSR cars deserves own registry category

The purpose of the web site 550WSR.com is to give overdue credit to the 1998 World Speed Records achievement; and document the registration and history of the 33 550WSR vehicles (32 survive).

The web site now has the accurate listing of all 10 RH vehicles imported by Tony Willis; but I will not list these VIN's on the Ferrari Life registry until a category for WSR is listed. The WSR special edition cars have a sale history and life of their own-compared to vanilla 550's and Barchettas; and they deserve their own category.

Thank you.
550wsr is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 18 Old 06-05-2016, 12:25 AM
Owner
 
Bluebottle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Exeter, England
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 550wsr View Post
The web site now has the accurate listing of all 10 RH vehicles imported by Tony Willis; but I will not list these VIN's on the Ferrari Life registry until a category for WSR is listed.
This sounds a bit like “spoiled child syndrome” – you don’t get to play with my ball unless you make me team captain.

With all due respect, I don’t see the reasoning behind according the WSR replicas a registry of their own. In several places on your website, you make it clear that even the Marysville car was a stock 550 with modifications. The replicas were, when all is said and done, effectively not much more than stock 550s with roll bars and FHPs. Arguably the RHDs were not even accurate replicas (steering wheel in the wrong place).

The Marysville car itself will obviously have a special place in history, but the replicas are just that, a limited edition (hence the price premium, like almost all Ferrari limited editions) run of stock 550s dressed up to replicate the car that set the records.

However, this is just my opinion. Doubtless others may think differently.

Best wishes, John
Ferrari: 550 Maranello S/N 110995, Dino 246 GT S/N 6934
Other: 1990 Bentley Turbo R, 1989 Porsche 911 C2, 2004 Mercedes 500CLK, 2011 Mercedes E350 CDI, 1972 VW T2 Camper, 2014 Fiat 500C, 1963 Jaguar E-type 3.8 FHC, 2015 Maserati Granturismo Sport
Website: http://bluebottleonline.com/
Bluebottle is offline  
post #3 of 18 Old 06-05-2016, 09:41 AM
Owner
Elite Member
 
tazandjan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Ferrari Life Posts: 11,848
As an example, the 575M HGTC was a much more extensive package of options, but we do not give them their own category. The WSR package is closer to the Corvette Indianapolis Pace Car options, with 550 options available on any 550 bundled together with a plaque. The plaque is the only unique feature.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
tazandjan is online now  
 
post #4 of 18 Old 06-05-2016, 12:45 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Ferrari Life Posts: 3
[QUOTE=Bluebottle;694098]This sounds a bit like “spoiled child syndrome” – you don’t get to play with my ball unless you make me team captain.

With all due respect, I don’t see the reasoning behind according the WSR replicas a registry of their own.
=========================
I'll ignore the childish remark and get to the point:

There is no other Ferrari that I'm aware of, known for setting anything like the three World Speed Records broken in 1998.
I cannot think of one.

So what if these are "replicas"? They're custom-designed (ie, the roll cage is different than Marysville) and limited in number (32 survive) and unique (like the record they honor) in the history of Ferrari.

Continuing to submerge the WSR's special existence in the history and perception of some 3000 other vanilla 550's is lazy, pure and simple. There is no mention of WSR (1998 or replicas) on Wikipedia's 550 page! Calling them "nothing special" does not acknowledge that the WSR's historic sales value appear to be consistently 50% greater than ordinary 550's. With "Brexit" on the horizon in the UK (determining if UK stays in EU) I would suggest that only US Dollar values be the standard for determining appreciation in vanilla 550's (now around $150-190,000) and WSR's (all are now hovering around $300,000 in value, with one example here in the UK perhaps "unrealistic"- but bravely staking claim for being "available" at 295,000 GBP or nearly $450,000). The markedly different value appreciation in WSR's alone is a reason to separate them as identifiably different vehicles- than ordinary coupes- with their own history.

According to Tony Willis who imported the 10 UK cars, the 33 WSR cars were -most- likely completed on a separate factory line (hand fitted and finished like F40's and F50s were). Yes, the "WSR1" option was attached to them. But that doesn't make them anything like a suspension package (derived from the 1998 WSR record run!) being sold as a dealer order option on some 575M's.

I was just offering this web forum shared data (which nobody else in the world has come up with regarding the 10 UK cars and compiled into an accurate list). But out of respect for the WSR cars I refuse to submerge that data into a list of vanilla 550's. I simply have more respect for the 550WSR in all respects. No problem. Nothing childish about it. I don't want to be "team captain" (well, maybe for a Premier League team or two, which I'd mention but you know how football rows go in a pub)!

People from this forum can see the vehicle data at 550WSR.com ...along with exclusive data, interviews and photos still unfolding.

Thanks for your consideration.
Cheers
550wsr is offline  
post #5 of 18 Old 06-05-2016, 09:22 PM
Owner
Elite Member
 
tazandjan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Ferrari Life Posts: 11,848
Wikipedia is written by amateurs just like you and me, so if you want something in there, put it in there yourself. Afraid most of us do not hold the 550 WSRs in as high esteem as you do, regardless of what the market currently shows. Three pedal 575Ms are going for way more than the WSRs, but I do not put those on a pedestal, either.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
tazandjan is online now  
post #6 of 18 Old 06-06-2016, 05:28 AM
Owner
 
intrepid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Saratoga Springs NY
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,004
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by tazandjan View Post
wikipedia is written by amateurs just like you and me, so if you want something in there, put it in there yourself. Afraid most of us do not hold the 550 wsrs in as high esteem as you do, regardless of what the market currently shows. Three pedal 575ms are going for way more than the wsrs, but i do not put those on a pedestal, either.
+1 !

Seth
575M F1, Maserati Spyder, Cadillac STS-V & CTS
past: 330/365GTC speciale, F355b, 412GT, 400iA, 308GT4 2+2, 330GT 2+2, Porsche 356b Super 90, BMW 1800ti

what do I know? I drive blue Ferraris
intrepid is offline  
post #7 of 18 Old 06-10-2016, 09:42 PM
PSk
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Ferrari Life Posts: 176
Very much doubt they were assembled on a separate assembly line ... but what do I know.

There IMO is only one WSR special car and that is the one that actually set the records. The others have achieved nothing.
Pete
PSk is offline  
post #8 of 18 Old 06-11-2016, 03:07 AM
Owner
Elite Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Ferrari Life Posts: 3,314
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSk View Post
The others have achieved nothing.
Well, they have made their owners happy.
So there is that...

Of all the narcissists I know, I love me the most.
Killer58 is offline  
post #9 of 18 Old 06-11-2016, 03:53 AM
Owner
 
Bluebottle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Exeter, England
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killer58 View Post
Well, they have made their owners happy.
So there is that...
But, David, ALL 550s make their owners happy, certainly this one: I love driving it and everything else about owning it (despite its more comfortable seats, easier to use seatbelts and lack of rollover bar and FHP!), AND the increase in value made it possible for me to buy my Dino, so as far as I am concerned, it's:

Best wishes, John
Ferrari: 550 Maranello S/N 110995, Dino 246 GT S/N 6934
Other: 1990 Bentley Turbo R, 1989 Porsche 911 C2, 2004 Mercedes 500CLK, 2011 Mercedes E350 CDI, 1972 VW T2 Camper, 2014 Fiat 500C, 1963 Jaguar E-type 3.8 FHC, 2015 Maserati Granturismo Sport
Website: http://bluebottleonline.com/
Bluebottle is offline  
post #10 of 18 Old 06-14-2016, 08:03 AM
bay
Owner
 
bay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Belgium
Ferrari Life Posts: 155
For me , not a WSR ?
Véhicules d'occasion in Waterloo BE

Present : Ghibli III V6 3.0 330 cv Grigio Maratea 571
Past :550 Maranello 1/98 110069 Ass 27389
http://www.bernardsport.be/maranello/
Registre 550
bay is offline  
post #11 of 18 Old 06-14-2016, 10:50 AM
Owner
Elite Member
 
tazandjan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Ferrari Life Posts: 11,848
I am afraid 550wsr shows his ignorance on Maranellos, too, with his comment that HGTC was a suspension package on the 575M derived from the WSR 550s. First off, FHP fitted to the original WSR vehicle was a regular production option fitted to 550s well before the record event, so it was not developed for or by the actual WSR 550 at all. Second, the HGTC package on the 575M included ceramic brakes and much more extensive and unique suspension mods than for 550 WSRs with FHP, including bespoke shock absorbers, under-panel and A-arm mods for brake cooling, suspension and F1 ECUs, specific, non-FHP, springs and rear anti-roll bar, specific wheels to fit the brakes, and numerous other changes. Like I said, WSRs included a package of regular production options: FHP, roll-bar on non-US 550s, racing seats, and 4 point seat belts on non-US 550s. All available on any 550. Plus a plaque.

Not knowing what you are talking about really gives you no credibility in this discussion.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
tazandjan is online now  
post #12 of 18 Old 06-15-2016, 01:07 AM
Owner
 
Bluebottle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Exeter, England
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bay View Post
So here's the rub. This car looks like a WSR replica, but I should have thought that, if it is an OFFICIAL replica, i.e. one of the 33 built by Ferrari as such, then the dealer would have included a photo of the plaque which I believe was fitted to all official WSR replicas. So one might conclude that this is not an official replica (were it not for the fact that it is being offered by a Ferrari appointed dealer, so it probably is).

However, let us suppose that it is not an official replica. It could, however, be an unofficial replica, i.e. a stock 550 that someone has converted (for whatever reason). If he used the correct parts throughout, then this would still be a WSR replica, identical in all respects to an official replica (which was a stock 550 that Ferrari converted to WSR spec). Does that make it any the less important than an official replica?

It seems to me that this WSR replica thing is a load of hype (Ferrari has always been quite good at that, perhaps even more so when the Old Man was alive) and, as per a previous post, the only WSR car that is really important, is the Marysville car itself.

Best wishes, John
Ferrari: 550 Maranello S/N 110995, Dino 246 GT S/N 6934
Other: 1990 Bentley Turbo R, 1989 Porsche 911 C2, 2004 Mercedes 500CLK, 2011 Mercedes E350 CDI, 1972 VW T2 Camper, 2014 Fiat 500C, 1963 Jaguar E-type 3.8 FHC, 2015 Maserati Granturismo Sport
Website: http://bluebottleonline.com/
Bluebottle is offline  
post #13 of 18 Old 06-15-2016, 04:21 AM
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Geneva area
Ferrari Life Posts: 50
Examples of the centre console mounted WSR plaques appear in the below listings.

2B Consulting Automotive :: 2000 Ferrari 550 Maranello World Speed Record

Historics at Brooklands - Specialist Classic and Sports Car Auctioneers - REF 32 2000 Ferrari 550 World Speed Record Edition

On the second listing, we see the full plaque and it appears as "WORLD SPEED RECORDS". Curious that it wasn't numbered in any way.


Also curious to me are some of the details in the "Vehicle Overview" in that 2B Consulting listing... although they appear to have been cribbed from comments posted on FerrariChat in 2007...

550 World Speed Recoord - FerrariChat.com

..by a former owner [Anjum].

· stiffer shock absorbers [Wrong. Presumably referring to the FHP suspension ECU from the 550 FHP kit (the only difference between the 550 and 575M FHP kits)]

· helicoidal springs [Aren't they all? Presumably referring to the FHP kit springs]

No reference to the FHP rear sway bar or brake pads...

· modified steering [this appears to refer to the steering ECU from the FHP kit]

· an infra-red tyre temperature control system [was this just on the Marysville car?]

· an automatic fire extinguisher [was this just on the Marysville car? I can't see one in the passenger footwell in the above examples but the photos aren't exhaustive.]

· rapid refuelling system [presumably just on the Marysville car!

Elsewhere on that 2007 thread was a reference to a feature in the 2/99 edition of Car and Driver and the alleged existence of a second fuel tank in the trunk [7.9 US Gallons / (30L)] that featured a dry-break...

Seems rather small in capacity but possibly big enough (and certainly faster to fill with the corresponding fuel rig) to secure some of those records!

And finally...

· an additional electronic pump to potentially over come power-steering or brake servo failure [again, presumably just on the Marysville car? Was this a back-up system (unlikely) or perhaps a replacement race-specification system??]

Without the race car fuel rig, power steering and hydraulics the 33(?) WSR cars should perhaps be more accurately described as 'commemorative editions' rather than true replicas and on that basis, the 'Schumacher edition' cars marketed in some territories might actually be a truer 'replica' of one of the cars that he was associated with!
Attached Images
 

Last edited by MogulBoy; 06-15-2016 at 05:01 AM.
MogulBoy is offline  
post #14 of 18 Old 06-15-2016, 05:05 AM
Owner
 
intrepid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Saratoga Springs NY
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,004
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluebottle View Post
So here's the rub. This car looks like a WSR replica, but I should have thought that, if it is an OFFICIAL replica, i.e. one of the 33 built by Ferrari as such, then the dealer would have included a photo of the plaque which I believe was fitted to all official WSR replicas. So one might conclude that this is not an official replica (were it not for the fact that it is being offered by a Ferrari appointed dealer, so it probably is).

However, let us suppose that it is not an official replica. It could, however, be an unofficial replica, i.e. a stock 550 that someone has converted (for whatever reason). If he used the correct parts throughout, then this would still be a WSR replica, identical in all respects to an official replica (which was a stock 550 that Ferrari converted to WSR spec). Does that make it any the less important than an official replica?

It seems to me that this WSR replica thing is a load of hype (Ferrari has always been quite good at that, perhaps even more so when the Old Man was alive) and, as per a previous post, the only WSR car that is really important, is the Marysville car itself.
+1

with this additional comment - much ado about absolutely nothing but a waste of time. I'd add only that Luca di M. brought hype, "added value" showmanship, exclusivity and income to the Company, to the level of fine art.

Seth
575M F1, Maserati Spyder, Cadillac STS-V & CTS
past: 330/365GTC speciale, F355b, 412GT, 400iA, 308GT4 2+2, 330GT 2+2, Porsche 356b Super 90, BMW 1800ti

what do I know? I drive blue Ferraris

Last edited by intrepid; 06-16-2016 at 05:29 AM. Reason: added info
intrepid is offline  
post #15 of 18 Old 06-15-2016, 06:41 AM
Owner
 
Bluebottle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Exeter, England
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MogulBoy View Post
Examples of the centre console mounted WSR plaques appear in the below listings.

2B Consulting Automotive :: 2000 Ferrari 550 Maranello World Speed Record

Historics at Brooklands - Specialist Classic and Sports Car Auctioneers - REF 32 2000 Ferrari 550 World Speed Record Edition

On the second listing, we see the full plaque and it appears as "WORLD SPEED RECORDS". Curious that it wasn't numbered in any way.
Not exactly the most difficult thing to replicate. In fact, probably the cheapest part of the whole conversion.

Best wishes, John
Ferrari: 550 Maranello S/N 110995, Dino 246 GT S/N 6934
Other: 1990 Bentley Turbo R, 1989 Porsche 911 C2, 2004 Mercedes 500CLK, 2011 Mercedes E350 CDI, 1972 VW T2 Camper, 2014 Fiat 500C, 1963 Jaguar E-type 3.8 FHC, 2015 Maserati Granturismo Sport
Website: http://bluebottleonline.com/
Bluebottle is offline  
post #16 of 18 Old 06-15-2016, 07:18 AM
Owner
Elite Member
 
tazandjan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Ferrari Life Posts: 11,848
Note that all 550s had provisions for TPMS, the warning lamp is there, but the system was not actually implemented until the 575M. This includes 550s built well before the WSR records were set. I think the answer is pretty plain. The actual WSR 550 was a mildly modified FHP 550 with a small fuel tank in the trunk. Not 100% sure if that trunk tank was the only tank or supplemented the main tank. Consumption in the test was likely 4-6 mpg, so 7.9 gallons was not going to last long (less than 50 miles), so likely a supplemental tank to do two things, get the distance required, and offer a quick refuel capability that fed both fuel tanks. None of this was added to the WSR commemorative cars. US car magazines ran top speed tests in the 90s and 00s and stock Maranellos, both 550s and 575Ms, ran 192-194 mph and were still accelerating when they had to slow for corners on the test circuits. Neither required any mods, or even FHP, to run those speeds.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
tazandjan is online now  
post #17 of 18 Old 06-15-2016, 08:38 AM
Owner
 
Bluebottle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Exeter, England
Ferrari Life Posts: 1,500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tazandjan View Post
Note that all 550s had provisions for TPMS, the warning lamp is there, but the system was not actually implemented until the 575M.
Terry, does that mean I could have TPMS retro-fitted to my 550?

Best wishes, John
Ferrari: 550 Maranello S/N 110995, Dino 246 GT S/N 6934
Other: 1990 Bentley Turbo R, 1989 Porsche 911 C2, 2004 Mercedes 500CLK, 2011 Mercedes E350 CDI, 1972 VW T2 Camper, 2014 Fiat 500C, 1963 Jaguar E-type 3.8 FHC, 2015 Maserati Granturismo Sport
Website: http://bluebottleonline.com/
Bluebottle is offline  
post #18 of 18 Old 06-15-2016, 12:32 PM
Owner
Elite Member
 
tazandjan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Ferrari Life Posts: 11,848
No, They made provisions for it in the MFD, but never implemented all the needed components like antennas and ECU. There are several good aftermarket systems, though, that give tire temperature, too.

Taz
Terry Phillips

Present: 575M 135171
Past: Dino 246 GT 02984, 365 GTB/4 14009, 308 GTS 25125

Every day I look around, and if nobody is shooting at me, it is a pretty good day.
tazandjan is online now  
Reply

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome
Copyright 2012 ONE Media, Inc.
FerrariLife is independently run with no affiliation with Ferrari SpA
Ferrari for Sale | Maserati for Sale