F1 OR 6 Speed on 360 coupe- Ferrari Virgin - Ferrari Life
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post #1 of 21 Old 05-17-2012, 07:43 AM Thread Starter
 
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F1 OR 6 Speed on 360 coupe- Ferrari Virgin

I have decided on gettting a 360 coupe, but have had conflicting advice and opinions on 6 speed vs F1 gearbox. Some experts tell me that a F1 costs far more than it is worth, but a local expert-- Gary Bobiloff tells me that a properly set up and maintained F1 is foolproof.

The 360 that I want has to be a standard coupe--Challenge Stradale need not apply. Must have standard wheels-- No modular or "hot rodder" wheels. Colour not that critical, but no white, pink, light blue or green. I like silver, red, titanium, maybe yellow.

Any suggestion, advice etc?
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post #2 of 21 Old 05-17-2012, 09:33 AM
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Jerry- Drive both, get the one you like. Gary has a lot of experience and actually did the last belt change on my 575M. She has F1, by the way, and I really love it. Remember, same clutch and transmission in both the F1 and three pedal cars on all the F1 dry plate clutch systems. F1 clutch life is really a function of driver technique, so not a discriminator.

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post #3 of 21 Old 05-19-2012, 06:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Jerry Lehrer View Post
I have decided on gettting a 360 coupe, but have had conflicting advice and opinions on 6 speed vs F1 gearbox. Some experts tell me that a F1 costs far more than it is worth, but a local expert-- Gary Bobiloff tells me that a properly set up and maintained F1 is foolproof.

The 360 that I want has to be a standard coupe--Challenge Stradale need not apply. Must have standard wheels-- No modular or "hot rodder" wheels. Colour not that critical, but no white, pink, light blue or green. I like silver, red, titanium, maybe yellow.

Any suggestion, advice etc?
I really enjoy the F1 tranny on my 360. Not as quick as my Scud, but still for me so much more fun than a manual. Also less effort. Taz gave good advice, go drive both. Best looking wheels IMO on a coupe are the CS wheels BTW.

I have had no issues on my F1 tranny, 8700 miles over 11 years. I drove 4500 miles in 18 months.
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post #4 of 21 Old 05-19-2012, 08:12 AM
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Mine is F1, I drove both, and good advice.
Took about half an hour to get used to it and if you have your hands full on a blat staying on the road its one less thing to think about, perfect gearchanges every time too.
Reversing is a PITA, ditto having to go into neutral when waiting at junctions but you get used to it. The auto mode does keep revs down and save fuel on the plus side.
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post #5 of 21 Old 05-19-2012, 08:28 AM
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I have driven lots of manual transmission cars and I absolutely love it. However, I also like to experience new things and I'm having a blast with the F1 transmission in my 360. For m it would just depend on when the right car came available. I'd take either tranny, but I would't waste any time looking for one over the other. IMO neither choice is a wrong one.
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post #6 of 21 Old 05-19-2012, 11:07 AM
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Only one that's works as both, anything earlier go stick, later go paddle
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post #7 of 21 Old 05-19-2012, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tazandjan View Post
Jerry- Drive both, get the one you like. Gary has a lot of experience and actually did the last belt change on my 575M. She has F1, by the way, and I really love it. Remember, same clutch and transmission in both the F1 and three pedal cars on all the F1 dry plate clutch systems. F1 clutch life is really a function of driver technique, so not a discriminator.
+1, you really need to drive them both and then decide which you prefer.
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post #8 of 21 Old 05-19-2012, 01:23 PM
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The F1 is a great system but if you have a manual mindset, there a couple of things you can't do with the F1 like heel-toeing, double clutching or downshifting straight several gears. Depending on your expectations, yes, the best is to try out both
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post #9 of 21 Old 05-19-2012, 03:15 PM
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Mine is F1, I drove both, and good advice.
Took about half an hour to get used to it and if you have your hands full on a blat staying on the road its one less thing to think about, perfect gearchanges every time too.
Reversing is a PITA, ditto having to go into neutral when waiting at junctions but you get used to it. The auto mode does keep revs down and save fuel on the plus side.
If you are having trouble getting into reverse, here are a couple things to try:

Always make sure you start the car in neutral, don't start in 1st and let the computer shift from 1st to neutral for you.

Before starting, select neutral, both paddles back, select 1st, then try reverse, works for me every time.

Sometimes pushing a bit harder on the brake pedal helps, sometimes I am barely touching it, so reverse will not engage.

Hope this helps.
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post #10 of 21 Old 05-20-2012, 02:16 AM
 
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Jerry- Drive both, get the one you like.
From your lack of preference on colors and options, it really sounds like performance is the paramountcy behind your purchase. Like Terry said, test drive both before making a decision. Personally, I prefer a manual, and I believe Ferrari's manuals are the pinnacle of straight shift sports car motoring. Both transmissions are equally integral to the car's experience, so this is not a decision you want to make with the help of a bunch of strangers on the Internet.

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post #11 of 21 Old 05-20-2012, 07:42 AM
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This:

From your lack of preference on colors and options, it really sounds like performance is the paramountcy behind your purchase. Like Terry said, test drive both before making a decision. Personally, I prefer a manual, and I believe Ferrari's manuals are the pinnacle of straight shift sports car motoring. Both transmissions are equally integral to the car's experience, so this is not a decision you want to make with the help of a bunch of strangers on the Internet.
Many 360 manual owners have said their cars must be warmed up, before they can easily shift from 1st to 2nd? Many just go 1st to 3rd until their cars are warm. No offense, but just drove a ZR1, and no issues when cold, getting the car into 2nd. Drove my Esprit last week, no trouble. Drove my GT2, no trouble. To me, that does not describe, uh, "pinnacle."
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post #12 of 21 Old 05-20-2012, 08:20 AM
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Mark- Had not heard that was a problem on 360s with the triple cone synchronizers from 1st to 2nd, provided a good synthetic 75W-90 transaxle oil was being used. No problem with F1, since 800-900 psi of hydraulic pressure overcomes all.

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post #13 of 21 Old 05-20-2012, 09:21 AM
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Many 360 manual owners have said their cars must be warmed up, before they can easily shift from 1st to 2nd? To me, that does not describe, uh, "pinnacle."
My Spider has never had a problem shifting when cold. Ever. Smoothest stick shift car I've ever driven.

There may be higher peaks, but it's definitely "my" pinnacle.

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post #14 of 21 Old 05-20-2012, 09:28 AM
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Mark- Had not heard that was a problem on 360s with the triple cone synchronizers from 1st to 2nd, provided a good synthetic 75W-90 transaxle oil was being used. No problem with F1, since 800-900 psi of hydraulic pressure overcomes all.
Many FCHAT owners have commented on this.
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post #15 of 21 Old 05-20-2012, 10:26 AM
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Before starting, select neutral, both paddles back, select 1st, then try reverse, works for me every time.
This is what I do, making sure the car is in neutral before I turn the ignition key. It won't go into reverse straight from neutral, like it says in the manual. And a push on the anchors does sometimes encourage it when it doesn't want to.

Going back and forwards takes some concentration even so.

I love the fact that even these relatively mass produced cars have the traditional Ferrari hand built foibles.

Thanks
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post #16 of 21 Old 05-20-2012, 12:25 PM
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V8- My F1 system goes straight into reverse from neutral every time I drive the car with no problems. I do start it in neutral every time, just like the OM recommends. Most of the F1 components are shared between the 575M and 360, but the software is different.

Mark- Had not seen that many comments in FChat, but it has been a while since I was there.

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post #17 of 21 Old 05-20-2012, 01:29 PM
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I was told by my dealer that some cars do work like mine, no big deal for me and I'm not concerned.
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post #18 of 21 Old 05-20-2012, 02:26 PM
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V8- Try it directly. Should work. In general, you can shift to reverse from N, 1st, or 2nd gear while stopped according to Ferrari. Dealers will tell you all kinds of BS. A problem on shifting to R is usually caused by starting the car in 1st and making it go through the extra steps of selecting neutral itself. This is especially true if the battery is slightly weak. Since you already said you start in neutral, you should have no problem. The OM says there will be a delay if you start in gear, but start will be instant if you start in neutral.

That problem was so bad some dealers were telling clients to leave the cars in neutral with the parking brake engaged so they would not start the car in gear. Really dumb when all they had to tell the client was to leave the car in gear when shut down, and then select neutral before start. Guess they did not think their clients were bright enough to remember that step, which is kind of insulting but...

A large part of the cars at a dealership usually have marginal batteries from lack of use, so you can see why they are gunshy. A friend's 575M actually lurched forward when he started it in gear with a marginal battery. At least that is his story.

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post #19 of 21 Old 05-23-2012, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by markjayw View Post
Many FCHAT owners have commented on this.
The "can't shift to 2nd when cold" story is well known in the Ferrari world. But let me tell you:

My 1966 GTC doesn't have that problem.
My 1974 Boxer doesn't have that problem.
My 2000 550 Maranello doesn't have that problem (unless outside temp is well below freezing).

To me, this story just comes from poorly maintained transmissions.

FWIW - on the 360 I prefer manual. I hate the clutch-slipping on the F1 360. I also know some people with high mileage 360's and their F1's are giving them all sorts of trouble, with the transmission ECU playing up. Last week in Italy, one of our party had to go home in the hire car as his 360's transmission called it quits.


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post #20 of 21 Old 05-24-2012, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by JazzyO View Post
The "can't shift to 2nd when cold" story is well known in the Ferrari world. But let me tell you:

My 1966 GTC doesn't have that problem.
My 1974 Boxer doesn't have that problem.
My 2000 550 Maranello doesn't have that problem (unless outside temp is well below freezing).

To me, this story just comes from poorly maintained transmissions.

FWIW - on the 360 I prefer manual. I hate the clutch-slipping on the F1 360. I also know some people with high mileage 360's and their F1's are giving them all sorts of trouble, with the transmission ECU playing up. Last week in Italy, one of our party had to go home in the hire car as his 360's transmission called it quits.


Onno
Could be a poorly maintained tranny, I agree.
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