State of Racing F1/Indy Car - Ferrari Life
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post #1 of 28 Old 05-25-2014, 02:44 PM Thread Starter
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State of Racing F1/Indy Car

The State of racing with F1 and Indy has two series headed in opposite directions. F1 has cars that sound like sportscars and penile projections sticking out of the front of the chassis, whilst Indy car now has races with 20+ lead changes and driver friendly events.

Fire away all you want, but as a pure racing fan, Indy car has my vote now and has for a few years. I know how many F1 fans are on these sites, but I am telling you they are going to gain momentum if the respective series' keep making the decisions they are in regard to the way they set up each series as a whole. I still watch F1, but it just doesn't have the allure it once did.

Today's two events were demonstrative of what I am feeling.

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MB

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post #2 of 28 Old 05-26-2014, 12:20 AM
 
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Indy car has two drawbacks for me: first, it has ovals and second, it doesn't have Ferrari. The number of lead changes to me seems inconsequential when the track is a simple oval. I thoroughly enjoyed the Grand Prix of Monaco, even with its zero lead changes, but 20 lead changes on an oval seems more indicative to me of a dull track rather than the quality of the racing. And as part of the tifosi, I can't find much of interest if the team I enjoy isn't on the track.
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post #3 of 28 Old 05-26-2014, 12:35 AM
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Frankly, you can keep both of them - for real spectator enjoyment, give me a good classic / historic meeting any day of the week.

And apparently I am not alone. While obviously we don't have any Indycar racing in the UK, so no figures to add to the comparison, as far as F1 is oncerned, attendance at the British GP in 2013 was 120,000 while the Goodwood Revival meeting attracted 148,000. OK, so the Goodwood meeting was a 3-day event, but even so it does make a point when a bunch of guys racing old cars, attracts comparable figures to those for an international event that is part of a £multi-billion global circus with world-wide television coverage and is supposed to epitomise the very pinnacle of motor racing in the country where more F1 teams are based than any other.

PS Lots of Ferraris in classic / historic racing, too!

Best wishes, John
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post #4 of 28 Old 05-26-2014, 10:41 AM
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I don't know matt. there is quite a bit of racing going on in F1 these days. Some of the best I have seen in years. Hate the cars themselves though.



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post #5 of 28 Old 05-26-2014, 06:01 PM Thread Starter
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Points well taken, and if you ask me I would put sportscar racing near the top of my list as well...I would go to Goodwood ANY day over either series, so I am jealous you have that across the pond.

WETPET and others, I get that Ferrari is not in Indy Car racing, but they really aren't in F1 right now either. Someone tell me that last time they won a race...?

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Originally Posted by Bluebottle View Post
Frankly, you can keep both of them - for real spectator enjoyment, give me a good classic / historic meeting any day of the week.

And apparently I am not alone. While obviously we don't have any Indycar racing in the UK, so no figures to add to the comparison, as far as F1 is oncerned, attendance at the British GP in 2013 was 120,000 while the Goodwood Revival meeting attracted 148,000. OK, so the Goodwood meeting was a 3-day event, but even so it does make a point when a bunch of guys racing old cars, attracts comparable figures to those for an international event that is part of a £multi-billion global circus with world-wide television coverage and is supposed to epitomise the very pinnacle of motor racing in the country where more F1 teams are based than any other.

PS Lots of Ferraris in classic / historic racing, too!

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post #6 of 28 Old 05-26-2014, 06:27 PM
 
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I am still partial to F1. But I will say, when the GP2 cars sound better that the F1 cars...something must be changed....
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post #7 of 28 Old 05-27-2014, 05:07 AM
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don't watch indy car. has nothing to do with ferrari though.



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post #8 of 28 Old 05-27-2014, 06:39 AM
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The current Indy cars are even uglier than F1... no small feat in its own right!

I think they both stink compared to years past, to put it bluntly. The racing is pretty good in both series, but the excitement of taming a 1000+ hp open wheeler is gone. And the looks are just heinous on both sides right now. Slow and ugly... not really great selling points. But, what else is there in the racing world? NASCAR?...
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post #9 of 28 Old 05-27-2014, 01:53 PM
 
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Indy cars certainly aren't pretty cars right now. F1 cars aren't beauty queens either, but I find the new noses don't bother me terribly (though it does seem that the safety purpose they were designed for is totally not met). F1 engines don't sound the same, but that doesn't affect the racing on track.

My personal preference would be a return to more flexibility in the regulations. I'd like to see a mix of turbo engines, naturally aspirated, electric, etc. Maybe a regulation which says you can use X amount of fuel in the race using whatever engine you want, or you can spend X amount on the power train using whatever power train you want.

What I don't want to see are more regulations designed to make the racing closer by forcing the cars to be the same. For me, F1 is at least as much of an engineering competition as it is a driving competition. The six-wheeled Tyrell was strange looking, but it was interesting because of the different look at the problem of mechanical grip.
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post #10 of 28 Old 05-28-2014, 05:26 PM Thread Starter
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I agree. The problem I often hear about Indy Car racing is that it is a spec series, but F1 has a rulebook that is so huge now it might as well be our Tax Code.

I agree both series have ugly cars, but similar to my 348 which didn't photo very well, the Indy Cars don't look that bad in person, I have yet to see the current F1 cars in action, but the sound is so bad that I am deeply saddened. I remember the 1200hp BMW 12 cylinders in Qually garb and watching the drivers handle those cars was great.

I guess F1 used to be the pinnicle of motorsport to me, and although I still watch is just isn't the same anymore. Sad.

MB

Quote:
Originally Posted by tiberius View Post
Indy cars certainly aren't pretty cars right now. F1 cars aren't beauty queens either, but I find the new noses don't bother me terribly (though it does seem that the safety purpose they were designed for is totally not met). F1 engines don't sound the same, but that doesn't affect the racing on track.

My personal preference would be a return to more flexibility in the regulations. I'd like to see a mix of turbo engines, naturally aspirated, electric, etc. Maybe a regulation which says you can use X amount of fuel in the race using whatever engine you want, or you can spend X amount on the power train using whatever power train you want.

What I don't want to see are more regulations designed to make the racing closer by forcing the cars to be the same. For me, F1 is at least as much of an engineering competition as it is a driving competition. The six-wheeled Tyrell was strange looking, but it was interesting because of the different look at the problem of mechanical grip.

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post #11 of 28 Old 07-21-2014, 08:07 PM
 
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F1 has DRS...are you kidding me?

It is not even a sport anymore.

The only real battles going on are in the lower series. Historic racing is 100x more interesting.

F1 is now entertainment just like NASCAR.

LS
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post #12 of 28 Old 07-22-2014, 01:21 PM
 
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Originally Posted by lashss View Post
F1 has DRS...are you kidding me?

It is not even a sport anymore.

The only real battles going on are in the lower series. Historic racing is 100x more interesting.

F1 is now entertainment just like NASCAR.

LS
What's wrong with DRS? You make it sound like it's new...It's been in F1 since 2011.
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post #13 of 28 Old 07-27-2014, 02:05 PM
 
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An unfair advantage gained without engineering prowess or driver talent? Can you imagine a season going down to the last race and being decided on the final lap's DRS zone? The overtaking driver having no skill to pass on his own but hits a switch and then wins the championship?

Maybe there should be big championship wrestling belts at the end of the season too.

Remember when qualifying meant the fastest car and driver were on pole position?

RIP - F1 as true sport

LS
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post #14 of 28 Old 07-27-2014, 03:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lashss View Post
An unfair advantage gained without engineering prowess or driver talent? Can you imagine a season going down to the last race and being decided on the final lap's DRS zone? The overtaking driver having no skill to pass on his own but hits a switch and then wins the championship?

Maybe there should be big championship wrestling belts at the end of the season too.

Remember when qualifying meant the fastest car and driver were on pole position?

RIP - F1 as true sport

LS
Using DRS doesn't automatically equal an overtake. The majority of the time there isn't even a noticeable advantage. If anything DRS adds another layer of strategy to the racing.

If you haven't enjoyed this season then you might want to make sure you still have a pulse. The racing has been spectacular wheel to wheel stuff.

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post #15 of 28 Old 07-28-2014, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
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If you haven't enjoyed this season then you might want to make sure you still have a pulse.
+1

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post #16 of 28 Old 07-28-2014, 03:07 PM
 
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DRS is an unfair advantage for the inferior driver...very simple. There is no way any athlete or pure sports enthusiast can overlook this.

This season has been more *entertaining* than the last few years of F1. It is certainly less *sporting* too.

There is good reason why fans and press haven't been hot on F1 for the better part of the last 15 yrs. It is boring, passing seems to happen after mechanical failures, ridiculous DRS renders any decent driving performance vulnerable, qualifying died in 2005, and the classic tracks are gone. I've only attended 22 F1 races live and I haven't bought an actual seat for the last 10 of them. They are so boring that it's not worth sitting in a seat only to enjoy two passes per hour. Then when someone "fouls", the unofficial result that fans just sat through live could change completely. Why even watch if the results could likely change due to an FIA ruling after the fact?

Yesterday's race was worth watching at regular speed due to Mother Nature and not anything Bernie could've engineered into the rulebooks. My pulse skyrocketed from 64 to 73bpm when I saw the rain coming down.

Entertainment? Maybe. Sport? No...

We'll get our sport at Le Mans, Daytona, Indycar, Goodwood, Isle of Man, NASCAR road courses and local karting leagues. Or, we can search for "Arnoux Villeneuve Dijon" on Youtube as a reminder of what real racing used to be like.

LS
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post #17 of 28 Old 07-29-2014, 04:49 AM
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best f1 year in awhile. in fact, with so many world champions out there, the last 3 years have been very exciting.



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post #18 of 28 Old 08-04-2014, 01:42 PM
 
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Decent Indy race at Mid Ohio yesterday...

How is this for racing action?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjs9K59gdHs

Historic/vintage racing can provide some of the greatest motorsports entertainment anywhere. Amazing cars, amazing sounds, and terrific racing.

LS
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post #19 of 28 Old 08-04-2014, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lashss View Post

How is this for racing action?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjs9K59gdHs

Historic/vintage racing can provide some of the greatest motorsports entertainment anywhere. Amazing cars, amazing sounds, and terrific racing.

LS
Awesome! is the best word I think
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post #20 of 28 Old 08-05-2014, 10:03 AM
 
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Quote:
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Historic/vintage racing can provide some of the greatest motorsports entertainment anywhere. Amazing cars, amazing sounds, and terrific racing.
In my opinion the big drawback with historic/vintage racing is that the cars are no longer being developed. I'm not suggesting at all that historic racing isn't exciting or that the cars aren't fun to watch. But for me a large part of the interest of motor racing is the development of the cars and the constant push to make them better.

And hey, Ferrari wasn't too far off from winning at the Hungaroring! I could almost hear the church bells in Maranello.
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