Transparency on Taxes - Ferrari Life
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post #1 of 30 Old 11-08-2012, 10:23 PM Thread Starter
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Transparency on Taxes

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Originally Posted by tazandjan View Post
Boxer- We just signed up for number two.
.
I thought this was a great idea and should also be done in the US.

At the GBP 50k income level, 1/3 of your taxes are income redistribution amd only 5.5% go to defence.

BBC News - Chancellor George Osborne to reveal taxpayers' spending statement


Chancellor George Osborne to reveal taxpayers' spending statement

Chancellor George Osborne is to set out plans in the Budget to give 20 million people a detailed breakdown of how their taxes are spent.

The plan, to be introduced in 2014, will set out how much people pay in direct taxes such as national insurance and income tax, outlining proportions used for education, health and welfare.

A Treasury source said it was "right" that people knew how taxes were spent.

It is part of attempts by ministers to make the tax system more transparent.

For example, someone earning just over 25,000 would pay 5,700 in direct taxes. Of that, more than 1,900 would go on welfare and pension payments, nearly 1,000 on health and 750 on education.

And 360 - some 6% - would go on national debt repayments.

The statement will not take account of indirect taxes such as VAT and fuel duty, although ministers are planning an online calculator to show people how much of these taxes they are paying too.

In November, Exchequer Secretary David Gauke announced the government's vision for greater tax transparency.

Speaking at the launch event, he said: "At the moment, for a lot of people, the tax line on their payslip is the only time they see just how much they're paying in tax, but the government doesn't think that's good enough.

"We want to make tax more transparent and we want people to be more engaged with their own tax affairs."

John Whiting, from the Chartered Institute of Taxation, welcomed the idea, saying that while HMRC and the government were responsible for running the tax system, people needed to take some responsibility in their own tax position.

"Of course there are lot of issues," he added, "For example, linking systems together, setting up help systems for people to sort out queries, managing confidentiality issues.

"But these should be soluble and shouldn't stop the idea being taken forward."
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post #2 of 30 Old 11-09-2012, 07:35 AM
 
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Make 25K, end up with ~19K. Make 50K, end up with 36K. Oh ya, cause that is fair. If that isn't an attack on the middle class, I don't know what is. And the biggest chunk, goes to welfare. For Americans that want figures in $, just multiply by 1.3 as this is the rough exchange rate. "Democracy", where those that don't have vote people into office who will take from those that do have. That is how you get Socialism.

*edit* exchange rate is actually 1.6, was thinking of the Euro.

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post #3 of 30 Old 11-09-2012, 07:53 AM
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Joe- Not even close. Exchange rate is ~1.6 to one and has been for quite a while.

Boxer- That is really bad. It is different here where 47% of the population pays no taxes at all and the upper middle class and wealthy carry all the tax burden as wealth is redistributed. Many of those 47% actually get a tax refund through various credits even though they paid no income tax. Will get worse with the current administration having no fears about getting reelected.

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post #4 of 30 Old 11-09-2012, 10:21 AM
 
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Ah, I was thinking of the Euro, not GBP. That just makes it worse. The sad thing is, what someone pays in taxes in GB is the same as the US, about 25% if you make 50K / $80K. That's fucked up, you shouldn't have to pay that much in income taxes. It's not like the Gov't helps people who pay the most in taxes.

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post #5 of 30 Old 11-09-2012, 11:02 AM
 
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Ah, I was thinking of the Euro, not GBP. That just makes it worse. The sad thing is, what someone pays in taxes in GB is the same as the US, about 25% if you make 50K / $80K. That's fucked up, you shouldn't have to pay that much in income taxes. It's not like the Gov't helps people who pay the most in taxes.
As taz said its wealth redistribution, why work hard for it when you can take from someone else and sit at home. Its the new american dream.
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post #6 of 30 Old 11-09-2012, 12:26 PM
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Ryan- Affirmative. Get together with some of your friends and have a party on how to get on Social Security Disability. Fake a mental illness and, if they turn you down, hire one of the lawyers who specializes in that field. Quite a distance from the greatest generation.

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post #7 of 30 Old 11-09-2012, 01:01 PM
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Payroll tax deductions started by FDR under the guise of paying for WW2 in a more timely fashion was maybe not the beginning but a giant step to the end. If everyone had to write a check every year for the whole amount instead of small payments every week taken out of your check this incremental death by taxes would never have happened.

I am not my accountants wealthiest client by any means but it scares me when he tells me I am the only one who asks when it is all over "How much did I pay?". Everyone else asks "How much do I get back?" as though it was not theirs to start with.


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post #8 of 30 Old 11-09-2012, 01:30 PM
 
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Ryan- Affirmative. Get together with some of your friends and have a party on how to get on Social Security Disability. Fake a mental illness and, if they turn you down, hire one of the lawyers who specializes in that field. Quite a distance from the greatest generation.

Yes I see it every day, I see the 20 year old on disability with fibromyalgia-a bullshit dx for those not aware- and anxiety with tats everywhere yada yada. I also see the old farmers and war vets. I always go out of my way for most but find it hard to even talk to the sacks of crap milking the system.
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post #9 of 30 Old 11-09-2012, 07:58 PM
 
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Yes I see it every day, I see the 20 year old on disability with fibromyalgia-a bullshit dx for those not aware- and anxiety with tats everywhere yada yada. I also see the old farmers and war vets. I always go out of my way for most but find it hard to even talk to the sacks of crap milking the system.
I would say most of the people milking the system come from the South, if you get my drift. Think of two ethnic groups when figuring out what exactly I mean. I'm not racist here, but there is a serious trend among those two. It's also worthless to watch the news in NM, it's always this person shot this person, this person killed this person because he was driving drunk, this person was arrested for having a meth lab, blah blah blah. And it's almost always the same damn kind of people. And these are also the same exact people who are milking the system, always complaining that they don't get enough Gov't assistance. That the Gov't should cook the meth for them.

Sorry guys, I'm just a bitter person right now and after I graduate, I want out of this damn state. Taz can confirm what I'm saying, our news stations spend close to half an hour every night just talking about all the shit these people cause. I've heard it called Mexicans on parade before. As I said, I'm not racist, I have many friends that are from all walks of life. I just can't stand all the shit.

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post #10 of 30 Old 11-10-2012, 05:51 AM
 
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I know what you mean... However dont underestimate the laziness of white trash types either. A lot of that around here.. Not a lot of ethnicity.
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post #11 of 30 Old 11-10-2012, 09:36 AM
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Joe- No, I think you are completely off base on this one. The parties for qualifying for SS disability I have heard about have been mostly on the coasts and in other larger cities and were held by well educated caucasians. Many are based on faking mental problems that are very difficult to disprove.

NM is no worse than any other state where crime is concerned. We do, however, have a real problem with drunk driving, most from multiple offenders who should have been put away but were not.

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post #12 of 30 Old 11-10-2012, 12:25 PM
 
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Taz, thanks for your honesty. Different perspectives are always good to have. I must see things differently. One thing that is not an opinion but a fact, when the newspaper releases the identities of DUI offenders, I think it is quarterly, there is a trend.

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post #13 of 30 Old 11-10-2012, 12:48 PM
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Joe- I go through the offenders list and look for people who have more than one offense during the three months or so between lists. Highest has been ten with at least two offenses and lowest was five. There was one 20 year old female who had three offenses in one list. Those people need to be put away.

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post #14 of 30 Old 11-10-2012, 03:19 PM
 
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Yes, they do. I remember that campaign slogan "you drink, you drive, you lose." and a few months after they starting running those ads on TV, there was a guy arrested for a DUI and was like his 10th one.

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post #15 of 30 Old 11-10-2012, 11:24 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer View Post
I thought this was a great idea and should also be done in the US.

At the GBP 50k income level, 1/3 of your taxes are income redistribution amd only 5.5% go to defence.

BBC News - Chancellor George Osborne to reveal taxpayers' spending statement


Chancellor George Osborne to reveal taxpayers' spending statement

Chancellor George Osborne is to set out plans in the Budget to give 20 million people a detailed breakdown of how their taxes are spent.

The plan, to be introduced in 2014, will set out how much people pay in direct taxes such as national insurance and income tax, outlining proportions used for education, health and welfare.

A Treasury source said it was "right" that people knew how taxes were spent.

It is part of attempts by ministers to make the tax system more transparent.

For example, someone earning just over 25,000 would pay 5,700 in direct taxes. Of that, more than 1,900 would go on welfare and pension payments, nearly 1,000 on health and 750 on education.

And 360 - some 6% - would go on national debt repayments.

The statement will not take account of indirect taxes such as VAT and fuel duty, although ministers are planning an online calculator to show people how much of these taxes they are paying too.

In November, Exchequer Secretary David Gauke announced the government's vision for greater tax transparency.

Speaking at the launch event, he said: "At the moment, for a lot of people, the tax line on their payslip is the only time they see just how much they're paying in tax, but the government doesn't think that's good enough.

"We want to make tax more transparent and we want people to be more engaged with their own tax affairs."

John Whiting, from the Chartered Institute of Taxation, welcomed the idea, saying that while HMRC and the government were responsible for running the tax system, people needed to take some responsibility in their own tax position.

"Of course there are lot of issues," he added, "For example, linking systems together, setting up help systems for people to sort out queries, managing confidentiality issues.

"But these should be soluble and shouldn't stop the idea being taken forward."
How do we get Congress to issue something similar?
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post #16 of 30 Old 11-11-2012, 01:47 AM
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How do we get Congress to issue something similar?
Six Billion was spent on the election - staggering number!

It was bought and paid for by those who write both the Federal and State tax code.

Stop the lobbyists and that tax code could have a shot.
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post #17 of 30 Old 11-11-2012, 04:11 AM
 
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Make 25K, end up with ~19K. Make 50K, end up with 36K. Oh ya, cause that is fair. If that isn't an attack on the middle class, I don't know what is. And the biggest chunk, goes to welfare. For Americans that want figures in $, just multiply by 1.3 as this is the rough exchange rate. "Democracy", where those that don't have vote people into office who will take from those that do have. That is how you get Socialism.

*edit* exchange rate is actually 1.6, was thinking of the Euro.
I can't remember the drop off, I think it's 29,000 and 30,000.

and the 30,000 gets taxed much more heavily and ends up getting less per year than the 29k salary.

I think that is the big drop off, but it might be a different number.

I never agree the higher social classes should be taxed so heavily and be made the scapegoats, these are individuals that work very hard and help the economy in one way or another.

If you take the 5 or 10 bus out of Oxford in a few minutes you would be transported to one ofthe biggest council estate in Europes, where they pay little taxes and get a lot of benefits. Most spend on drugs or clothes or just waste it away in the pub because they have nothing else to do with their lives.

I don't think these type of people deserve benefits -- as it's wasted away.

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post #18 of 30 Old 11-11-2012, 04:20 AM
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I can't remember the drop off, I think it's 29,000 and 30,000.

and the 30,000 gets taxed much more heavily and ends up getting less per year than the 29k salary.

.

That can't happen in the US system because everyone pays the same rate on the same block of money......so if the rate is 6% on the first 29k then 10% on 30k-50k every pays 6% on the first 29k and then the higher rate applies only to the 30k-50k block of money.
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post #19 of 30 Old 11-11-2012, 04:31 AM
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Boxer- That is really bad. It is different here where 47% of the population pays no taxes at all and the upper middle class and wealthy carry all the tax burden as wealth is redistributed. Many of those 47% actually get a tax refund through various credits even though they paid no income tax. Will get worse with the current administration having no fears about getting reelected.
That is not really true. 47% pay no income tax, that's true, but they do pay 12.6% payroll tax federally then locally they generally pay 6-10% sales tax, property tax, school tax and sometimes a vehicle tax. so it can be quite a large chuck. I think it's only one of the temp programs from the 2008 crash that let any get a federal refund beyond what they actually paid in, normally any "negative" tax makes a 0.

That 12.6% payroll tax really then you get income taxed up to 35% on anything after that vs a 15% once and done cap gain tax for the non-payroll crowd seems indefensible to me since it leads to the wealthiest paying a MUCH MUCH lower tax rate that the vast majority. I would think the right way to do that is to hold the Cap in a separate account where the cap gain is 15% to encourage re-investment, but if you pull the money out, it's income and gets income tax as such.
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post #20 of 30 Old 11-11-2012, 08:38 AM
 
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That can't happen in the US system because everyone pays the same rate on the same block of money......so if the rate is 6% on the first 29k then 10% on 30k-50k every pays 6% on the first 29k and then the higher rate applies only to the 30k-50k block of money.
and at the end of all of this, this is where some of the UK's taxed money goes to

Benefits couple claiming 30,000 for 11 children have ANOTHER on the way | Mail Online

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