365, 400 or 412? - Ferrari Life
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post #1 of 24 Old 06-04-2014, 12:36 AM Thread Starter
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365, 400 or 412?

In a quest for a "family-friendly" Ferrari to complement my 550, I am toying with the idea of a 365 / 400 / 412, preferably with a manual box.

While I am attracted to the looks of the 365, are the later cars a better bet - more reliable, better equipped, etc.?

Just how good are the rear seats? Are they comfortable for a reasonable sized adult? How would my 5'8" daughter find it sitting behind her 6'1" father?

Any thoughts on the subject would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Best wishes, John
Ferrari: 550 Maranello S/N 110995, Dino 246 GT S/N 6934
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post #2 of 24 Old 06-18-2014, 12:48 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluebottle View Post
In a quest for a "family-friendly" Ferrari to complement my 550, I am toying with the idea of a 365 / 400 / 412, preferably with a manual box.

While I am attracted to the looks of the 365, are the later cars a better bet - more reliable, better equipped, etc.?

Just how good are the rear seats? Are they comfortable for a reasonable sized adult? How would my 5'8" daughter find it sitting behind her 6'1" father?

Any thoughts on the subject would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Hi,
A friend of mine used my 412 last week-end and he is 6ft 1" (1m85), the driver seat is still adjusted for him, so I (5ft 8") sat behind the driver seat (see picture). It is not what one could call a comfortable seating position, the knees need to be around the driver seat, there is no other way, I tried to have my legs sideways but it is not possible. OK for perhaps 15 minutes or so but not much more (at least for me).
All cars from 365 GT4 2+2 to 412 have a very similar seating arrangement, so I believe the experience I did this morning would apply generally.
I hope this helps.
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post #3 of 24 Old 06-18-2014, 04:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Bluebottle View Post
In a quest for a "family-friendly" Ferrari to complement my 550, I am toying with the idea of a 365 / 400 / 412, preferably with a manual box.

While I am attracted to the looks of the 365, are the later cars a better bet - more reliable, better equipped, etc.?

Just how good are the rear seats? Are they comfortable for a reasonable sized adult? How would my 5'8" daughter find it sitting behind her 6'1" father?

Any thoughts on the subject would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

John, your question about the 2+2 seating has been answered. I would only add that a few years ago my sister-in-law visited with her son and grandson - my nephew and 8 year-old grand-nephew and four of us spent the day together with my 412GT. Lydia sat in front with the passenger seat forward permitting 40 year-old Josh to sit behind her and, with driver's seat full back, my 8 year-old grand-nephew sat comfortably behind me. But for a long trip, all of these cars are 2 seaters.


You are correct to be looking for a manual transmission car since IMHO you should under no circumstances consider an automatic. These are fine for motorway travel but awful for fast driving on secondary and other challenging roads - which is really what Ferrari driving is all about.



I'm biased with my 412GT but believe you ought to be after a 412 or a late 400i 5-speed. There will be some who prefer the sound of the carbureted cars but after all, Ferrari believed they were producing better cars with each subsequent model.

Seth
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post #4 of 24 Old 06-18-2014, 09:21 AM
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Seth- Ferrari also started a rust-proofing program in the 1983 timeframe and the earlier cars are much more susceptible to rust.

Taz
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post #5 of 24 Old 01-17-2015, 09:17 PM
 
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These cars are becoming very hard to find. I'm in the market for manual one; even automatics are becoming scares in the market.
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post #6 of 24 Old 01-18-2015, 11:21 AM
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As much as it makes me recoil to suggest, what about a 3.2 Mondial or a 456? I would think these would be easier to find and easier to work on. FWIW, I was surprised to see what 575M's and 612's were going for when I looked online! That would be more than family friendly enough.

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post #7 of 24 Old 01-26-2015, 04:57 AM
 
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I started out looking for a 456 and believe that you would find the drive to be 'too similar' to your current car. I ended up looking at 400/412's and drove several finally finding a 400 with carbs and 5 speed. They are easier to work on than the newer cars only because they have virtually no electronics. Parts are available. I would argue that an automatic 412 with a shift kit in the transmission will outrun a 5spd car but may not be as fun.
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post #8 of 24 Old 01-26-2015, 09:33 AM
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GT- Welcome to Ferrari Life. That was only a three speed automatic, and ill-matched to the torque curve of the 60 degree V12s, unlike the 456/456M four speed automatic. So I doubt one is going to be quicker than a well driven 5 speed, shift kit or not.

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post #9 of 24 Old 01-26-2015, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluebottle View Post
In a quest for a "family-friendly" Ferrari to complement my 550, I am toying with the idea of a 365 / 400 / 412, preferably with a manual box.

While I am attracted to the looks of the 365, are the later cars a better bet - more reliable, better equipped, etc.?

Just how good are the rear seats? Are they comfortable for a reasonable sized adult? How would my 5'8" daughter find it sitting behind her 6'1" father?

Any thoughts on the subject would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Hi John,
Also I am attracted to the looks of the 365 and, if i could, i would to buy one ....
For a family use i think a 412 is better, but why not a 456 or 612 manual?


http://ww3.autoscout24.it/classified...261?asrc=st|as

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post #10 of 24 Old 01-27-2015, 06:36 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by 550_Maranello View Post
Hi John,
Also I am attracted to the looks of the 365 and, if i could, i would to buy one ....
For a family use i think a 412 is better, but why not a 456 or 612 manual?


Ferrari 400 i MANUALE conservata-tagliandata-ottime condizioni usata, Benzina, € 51.000,- a Isorella - Brescia - Bs
A number of reasons. I love the looks of the 365/400/412 - I think it is one of the nicest looking sporting 4-seaters anyone has ever designed. 456 is very nice, but too similar to the 550. I have never liked the look of the 612, though it would probably be the best car to drive and for rear seat comfort. Current thinking is a Maserati GT S with MC shift: gorgeous to behold and a wonderful sound-track, plus decent rear seats.

Best wishes, John
Ferrari: 550 Maranello S/N 110995, Dino 246 GT S/N 6934
Other: 1990 Bentley Turbo R, 1989 Porsche 911 C2, 2004 Mercedes 500CLK, 2011 Mercedes E350 CDI, 1972 VW T2 Camper, 2014 Fiat 500C, 1963 Jaguar E-type 3.8 FHC, 2015 Maserati Granturismo Sport
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post #11 of 24 Old 01-27-2015, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Bluebottle View Post
A number of reasons. I love the looks of the 365/400/412 - I think it is one of the nicest looking sporting 4-seaters anyone has ever designed. 456 is very nice, but too similar to the 550. I have never liked the look of the 612, though it would probably be the best car to drive and for rear seat comfort. Current thinking is a Maserati GT S with MC shift: gorgeous to behold and a wonderful sound-track, plus decent rear seats.

Hi John,
yes, also for me the 612 it would probably be the best car to drive and for rear seat comfort.
Hahaha .... Maserati GT S , have nice sound, is only little is a bit heavy....
you have nice taste ...
Good luck!

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post #12 of 24 Old 02-07-2015, 03:08 AM
 
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Im also looking for a manual 412 actually. I love the looks, and of course I think it has to be by far the most boring Ferrari to drive fast but as driving a Ferrari is an event itself maybe a confortable, chilled by the AC and V12 sounding turns it a one to go for.


The 365 and 400 hat the GM 3 speed auto and the 412 got the 4 speeder that was used right to the 456. I discard autos, that V12 has to be mated to the five speed manual.

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post #13 of 24 Old 02-07-2015, 07:12 AM
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No relationship between the 412 3 speed automatic (look at the owners manuals) and the one fitted to the 456/456M. The latter had a basis in a GM 4 speed, but was very heavily modified.

Taz
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post #14 of 24 Old 02-07-2015, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Bluebottle View Post
A number of reasons. I love the looks of the 365/400/412 - I think it is one of the nicest looking sporting 4-seaters anyone has ever designed. 456 is very nice, but too similar to the 550. I have never liked the look of the 612, though it would probably be the best car to drive and for rear seat comfort. Current thinking is a Maserati GT S with MC shift: gorgeous to behold and a wonderful sound-track, plus decent rear seats.
Hi John

I have now owned 3 of Maserati's GranTurismo GT S with MC Shift, I am 6'2" and have no problem fitting tall adult friends in the rear seats, atop this the sound is terrific as is the driving position. It's also great fun in the twisties. The MC Sportsline model is the best for driving enjoyment, being lowered 10mm & an extra 10bhp. If you are thinking MC Shift you're obviously talking 4.7 litre & 440bhp. I have also owned 2 MC Stradale's & can't recommend these high enough, talk about being like a gokart, these are properly sorted, albeit they only had 2 seats...& only 41 were sold in UK. Servicing any GranTurismo is 12.5k miles or 2 years (whichever is soonest) & usually costs circa 1.8k at an Official Maserati Dealer. If I can assist in any way please just send me a PM. Good luck in your decision & search.

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post #15 of 24 Old 02-07-2015, 08:47 PM
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Peter- Did those Stradales have flat plane cranks? I remember at least one of those Maseratis had the Ferrari-style 180 degree crank.

Taz
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post #16 of 24 Old 02-08-2015, 04:16 AM
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365, 400 or 412?

Our European version did Terry, terrific engine & sound.

Single clutch gearbox as per 599 GTO, 430 Scud & 16M with 60ms shifts too.

Also, if you hold onto the downshift paddle it'll jump from 6th to 1st or any gear in between to match the speed & revs in one movement, great for racing, cornering, couple this with the carbon seats from the MC12 & Enzo & the stopping power of the carbon ceramic brakes & you have a very special confidence inspiring drivers car....

Yesterday's history, tomorrow's a mystery, today's a gift.....enjoy every minute!


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post #17 of 24 Old 02-08-2015, 10:35 AM
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Peter- Sounds like a fun car. Was the clutch twin dry plates like the 599 and F430 and their derivatives?

Taz
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post #18 of 24 Old 02-08-2015, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by goliat View Post
Im also looking for a manual 412 actually. I love the looks, and of course I think it has to be by far the most boring Ferrari to drive fast but as driving a Ferrari is an event itself maybe a confortable, chilled by the AC and V12 sounding turns it a one to go for.


The 365 and 400 hat the GM 3 speed auto and the 412 got the 4 speeder that was used right to the 456. I discard autos, that V12 has to be mated to the five speed manual.
Agreed as to the design appearance, though I'm biased. Year ago Peter Stevens, chief designer at Lotus, called the 365/400/412 series "the most beautiful production car of all time". Disagree about the cars being boring. Certainly none of them handles like the later GT cars, let alone the 8-cylinder sports Ferraris. But they can still be driven 'sportingly'. My 412 5-speed has been on track at Watkins Glen though not really thrashed. And it is seerious fun on some of our mountain roads hereabouts. [some here have doubtless already seen the below photo]
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post #19 of 24 Old 02-09-2015, 12:33 AM
 
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Seth, your car is, at least for me, the 412 colour combination to go for. Im actually after two units identical to yours (Sebring Blue with beige interior?) and one Nurburgring silver with black interior.


And I agree to what stated, its elegant and classy to die for.


Can you please tell me what to specially check on them (Ive read about the self levelling suspension, the silentblocks on the suspension components and belts and oils changed on date).

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post #20 of 24 Old 02-09-2015, 01:07 AM
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For some strange reason, I suspect my next F-car will be either a 456 Manual or a 550 Manual, They did not appeal much to me in the past, but now they are starting to really grow on me, especially when I saw a nice 456 GT for $49k last week... Unbelievable value in my opinion. A true V-12 GT car that you can still work on yourself.

M
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