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Old 03-18-2009, 06:17 AM   #1
 
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Default Questions about Ferrari 348 ts

Through ebay and autotrader I've noticed that many of these cars are selling for fairly decent prices, $32k-$40k. If memory serves me well, I think they were selling for around $50k-$60k just a year or so ago. This car seems to be a good entry level Ferrari, just my perception, please correct me if I AM WRONG! The wife even bit off on it, which truly means something, if you know what I mean.

1. What are some of the mechanical issues with this particular car? If any.

2. Understanding that Ferrari maintenance cost are higher than a normal car, how is this particular car compared to other Ferrari's with regards to maintenance cost?

3. What is the general feeling of the car? Such as reliability, desire, fun factor, and anything else you may think of.

4. If you are or were an owner of this car, what are your feelings about it and why?

5. And finally, does anyone expect the value and market price to drop any further or has it already hit it's low point? I've seen cars like this decrease in value and market price over the last year, is there an expectation that these cars will pick up value in the future or remain the same?

Thank you for your time and have a great day.

Shawn


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Old 03-18-2009, 12:08 PM   #2
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Sean,

I will try to answer a few I know until others with 348's chime in.

1. What are some of the mechanical issues with this particular car? If any.
-pretty reliable but has had clutch issues due to the packing.

2. Understanding that Ferrari maintenance cost are higher than a normal car, how is this particular car compared to other Ferrari's with regards to maintenance cost?
-engine has to be removed for most major services but it should be in-line with most. I'd figure $1k-$2K per year in average costs.

3. What is the general feeling of the car? Such as reliability, desire, fun factor, and anything else you may think of.
-great car to drive. No power steering. Later years have a bit more HP.

4. If you are or were an owner of this car, what are your feelings about it and why?
-I can't answer this one!

5. And finally, does anyone expect the value and market price to drop any further or has it already hit it's low point? I've seen cars like this decrease in value and market price over the last year, is there an expectation that these cars will pick up value in the future or remain the same?
-hard to know but with ferwer than later models built these should hold their values and maybe in a year of so climb a bit.

Just remember that these cars are 20+ years old and things happen especially electrically!
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Old 03-18-2009, 12:22 PM   #3
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I'd figure $1k-$2K per year in average costs.
If you plan on a major every three years, then that alone comes to $1.5 - $2k per annum. Overall, I'd say $2.5 - $3k/annum on maintenance, tires, and brakepads alone. But I'm not a 348 owner.


Onno
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Old 03-18-2009, 12:40 PM   #4
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Sean,

I will try to answer a few I know until others with 348's chime in.

1. What are some of the mechanical issues with this particular car? If any.
-pretty reliable but has had clutch issues due to the packing.

-- The packing is a problem sometimes, but the real issue is gearbox rear 'nut' that may work loose. A good mech, can take off the cover reach in there and see if it's on tight. There were a certain run of 348 trans, where they handtighted the trailing nut onto the spindle instread of pressing them on like they should have. Some worked loose and catastrophic gear damage...called the '348 gear issue'. to some
-- belts are always an issue.
-- Alternator if NOT upgraded/updated with better released parts, can fail. not a big issue in these can be rebuilt, and taken off in situ.
-- ECU upgrade for leveling on suspension: New one costs about $800-1,100 for new software being made.
-- Fuse blocks. They tend to delaminate and/or fry due to such: about $800-1,200 for new [lucky to find one].
-- Front wheel bearings which require two to a side, where a pair [youll need two] = $1,100 each AND GOOD Luck finding them. Used on the F40 TRs and most 308/328 models.
--water pump replacement/fix requirs an engine out, which might as well replace the belts while in there etc. = if just engine out = $6,000 from mech...if doing a timing and belts = $6-8k.
--bilstein suspension rebuilds: about $200 per item in/out, sent, rebuilt each.
--'sometimes' an adjusting/leveling motor goes out...not a big deal about $100. Gear can be bought better than OEM for $100/four.
-- TS had leaking issues to removed top, but can be fixed: I like the TS of the 348 series.
--switches = BOSCH, = not to bad, just getting to them is the issue.
--tensioners/bearings. Get the better Hill replacements = $600-800 each and sleep better.

2. Understanding that Ferrari maintenance cost are higher than a normal car, how is this particular car compared to other Ferrari's with regards to maintenance cost?
-engine has to be removed for most major services but it should be in-line with most. I'd figure $1k-$2K per year in average costs.
--greag has it right.
--oil changes [I highly recommend ALL fluids even radiator as too caustic on these older alum. jobs] for your price or mech charging <>+/- $500-1,200/year.
--get K&N air Filters and not a future issue.
--tires about every two-three years...depending on your habits.
--battery tender $80 onetime
--upgraded/enhance booster for starting = $80 onetime
--a light here, a bulb there, an air strut in-between, cleaning self, or not,
--oneoffs like hoses as these are older
--Steering reservoir had two types, older one replaced with upgraded release = $600-800. Steering hoses cost about $200, and some need rebuilding = $300. BUt good to go for years once done.

3. What is the general feeling of the car? Such as reliability, desire, fun factor, and anything else you may think of.
-great car to drive. No power steering. Later years have a bit more HP.
--Mondial T has power assisted steering RP, but not the 348.
--T HP vs 348 is only about 5HP diff, but, T=heavier.
--348 engine is rock solid. Reliable unless you f##k up the belts/don't do maintenance.

4. If you are or were an owner of this car, what are your feelings about it and why?
-I can't answer this one!
--no answer to this: You like/love it or get something different. I know where you want to go, but that'll be a specific owner question.

5. And finally, does anyone expect the value and market price to drop any further or has it already hit it's low point? I've seen cars like this decrease in value and market price over the last year, is there an expectation that these cars will pick up value in the future or remain the same?
-hard to know but with ferwer than later models built these should hold their values and maybe in a year of so climb a bit.
--It'll drop. Some will sell theirs short, some will not/never as I probably. There are NO bargains in Ferraris, there are only ones that truely need to acquire their equilibrium and that requires one to bring it up to its critical mass or get it sorted correctly. They basically all cost or are about the same. IF you see one less, good as probably needs stuff etc etc.
FIND the best, sorted and loved model you can find. Leave a buffer in first 1-2 years for an issue to creep up, say $5k, and go from there. If it needs stuff, especially a QUALIFIED tuning/major, that is a huge negotiation point and will not qualify it as top dollar.

Just remember that these cars are 20+ years old and things happen especially electrically!
+1

Greg, Sean: I have elaborated a bit on the above.

rik

PS: There are more than shown.


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Last edited by Granucci; 03-18-2009 at 12:45 PM.
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Old 03-18-2009, 06:25 PM   #5
 
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Wow...what I've realized is that you guys are a wealth of knowledge, I appreciate and respect that. I can only hope to become as knowledgable about this brand as you all are. I agree 110% that you get what you pay for. The additional cost in this department could help to side step some existing and future issues. I'm heading over to Ferrari of Atlanta tomorrow to see if I can pick the brain of a tech or knowledgable salesman. Not that you guys aren't helpful but I want to exhaust all avenues with regards to the subject. I do have another question which I don't feel the Ferrari tech will give an honest answer on.

Would sourcing some of the maintenance out to a general mechanic who's ASE certified be a wise decision?

-or-

If I were to complete a certificate based course and enhance my knowledge of automotive maintenance would you recommend that I tackle some of the maintenance myself? The course is free for me and I do have access to a hydraulic lift and any tool I could possibly need due to on post privileges through the automotive center. And this would give me a good reason to go ahead with the course as it has been an interest of mine for some time.

Thank you for time and have a great day.

Shawn


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Old 03-18-2009, 06:42 PM   #6
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Shawn

Repair work on a Ferrari is the same as any other car. You need patience and detail to do the work.

ASE certified mechanics mean little in the Ferrari world, however. You need an experienced person. For one unfamiliar with Ferrari to attempt a timing belt change could be a disaster. If he followed the W/S manual by the book, had good timing belt experience with other vehicles, it should not be a problem.

You also need the workshop manual for the particular vehicle and don't attempt much w/o it.

The bottom line is that there are no shortcuts to Ferrari maintenance.

You can certainly do much of the work if you are mechanical. It's not rocket science but it is dangerous to lean if you possess little automotive experience.
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Old 03-18-2009, 10:15 PM   #7
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Shawn sounds to me like you will make a good 348 owner. You are taking the time to get to know 348 well, keep asking questions and do tonnes of research. I certainly did my fair share before I pulled the trigger on my spider and I was glad I did.

The boys have answered almost all your previous questions.

I have had minor issues with the car the most expensive was replacing the slave cylinder ($1500 installed). When it happened I didn't panic I almost instantly knew what the problem was I got on this site and others to confirm my diagnosis, was given a part # and ph num to Ricambi 1 day later I was on the road again. That is the beauty about the Ferrari 348 brotherhood there is nothing that has not been discussed repaired or tried by the other owners, you will never be alone if any issues arise.

This car is awesome any way you look at it not only in performance but in aesthetics(opinions vary lol) the lines are unmistakable Ferrari everyone knows what this car is first time they lay their eyes on it. And if you have not seen one of these beauties up close pictures do not do Justice at all.

Ps the more you drive the 348 the better she gets you will know what I mean when you become part of the Brotherhood.


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Old 03-19-2009, 04:10 PM   #8
 
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I visited Ferrari of Atlanta today, and I gotta say what a pleasant experience it was. I walked in and was instantly greeted by the receptionist. I asked to speak with a mechanic and was given access to the service area. The mechanic I spoke with was working on a 599 and graciously stopped what he was doing and spent the next 45+ minutes answering my questions. What a nice guy and very informative. He confirmed everything you all have said and elaborated on a few subjects. I think he went above and beyond what I could have expected. I was in uniform so due to that we usually form a small crowd and I had the pleasure of meeting most of the Ferrari techs as well as the Aston Martin techs who decided to leave their areas and pick my brain about the Army. Which I admit was fun. I also had a few questions with regards to my younger brother who is interested in becoming a mechanic. These guys were very helpful on this subject as well. They even asked me to bring my brother by the dealer so they could meet with him and answer any of his questions. In the end I realized that these guys aren't so different from myself. They all agreed that a Ferrari purchase is one that many feel isn't possible but is goal that is very obtainable. They advised me on how to go about the purchase and some questions to ask the seller.

Overall great experience, except for the idiot talking on his cell phone, who almost hit me as I pulled into the lot. I was a little butt hurt and boo boo lipped by that one but my attitude quickly changed when I heard a Mondial fire up and pull into the service area. I'm usually a dry serious type but today I was grinning from ear to ear.

Shawn


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Old 03-19-2009, 07:38 PM   #9
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F of A is a good dealership. Very professional and you experienced this. I had dealings with them about 4 years ago, and they were superb. Salesman was Craig Forbes.

Obviously they were helpful and that's good.

Take your time. Get very familiar with the 348, and then make your decision.

Just don't jump into it quickly.
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Old 03-20-2009, 11:18 PM   #10
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Quote:
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Take your time. Get very familiar with the 348, and then make your decision.

Just don't jump into it quickly.
+10 Take your time and never fall in love with the first one unless you are sure.


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Old 03-21-2009, 08:30 AM   #11
 
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I would also agree, to find that perfect one I'll have to be patient. The good thing is I'm in no rush to make a purchase, even though I'd love to have one right now. I'd rather take my time, continue to learn about the cars, and in doing so I'll come across those fine examples. It's definetely going to be the most exciting and important purchase of my life but it's one I'm willing to wait for. The only other time I took this much time to research and purchase something would have to be my Wilson Combat Tactical Supergrade .45 ACP. I researched and did comparisons for over a year before jumping on the $4000 price tag of this fine 1911 style handgun. But in the end it was worth every penny.

Thanks again to all of you and have a great day,

Shawn


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Old 03-23-2009, 12:30 PM   #12
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I would also agree, to find that perfect one I'll have to be patient. The good thing is I'm in no rush to make a purchase, even though I'd love to have one right now. I'd rather take my time, continue to learn about the cars, and in doing so I'll come across those fine examples. It's definetely going to be the most exciting and important purchase of my life but it's one I'm willing to wait for. The only other time I took this much time to research and purchase something would have to be my Wilson Combat Tactical Supergrade .45 ACP. I researched and did comparisons for over a year before jumping on the $4000 price tag of this fine 1911 style handgun. But in the end it was worth every penny.

Thanks again to all of you and have a great day,

Shawn
Hi Shawn, Looks like were in the same boat here. Great questions by the way, I am being patient as well, no such thing as a cheap Ferrari, But these guy's are a wealth of knowledge and I wont be jumping in till I get there opinions.

Happy hunting!
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Old 05-27-2011, 09:17 AM   #13
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I know this post is old but they're usually the best to read and some great info here. I have been researching the 328 and 348 for years waiting for the right one and right time. I am coming close, just need the right one, 348 that is...

The lines, the looks, the sounds...wow, I can't stop thinking about it, but this forum is great! I hope to post a pic with the new horse in the stable soon. Thanks for the great info.
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Old 05-27-2011, 10:21 AM   #14
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I know this post is old but they're usually the best to read and some great info here. I have been researching the 328 and 348 for years waiting for the right one and right time. I am coming close, just need the right one, 348 that is...

The lines, the looks, the sounds...wow, I can't stop thinking about it, but this forum is great! I hope to post a pic with the new horse in the stable soon. Thanks for the great info.
Welcome to FL and good luck with your search, joshman. w/ smiles Jimmy
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Old 05-27-2011, 10:47 AM   #15
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+1 : Welcome.

IF you have more questions regarding the 348, fire away. There are many here that have insights to that model.

as for the engine, my wife is STILL [ -- NOT her fault!! ] rebuilding the 348 and what's inside might be of interest. They are solid, but some of the exterior items need careful consideration.

Case in point right now is many older Ferraris are aging on the fuel-tank recirc canister which can do some interesting interior buildup, if not damage.

She with help has also found the rear, crank bearing to NEVER have been used, yet the Crank is in perfect alignment/specs!!! Means to me the rear block part had some finishing probs at the factory. Don't get me started on the gouges found on the block head plates etc. Luigi absolutlely had toooooo much Chianti that afternoon. Almost shameful.

SO, having said that. You may not get a PPI in today's climate, but do, at least get a compressin and leak down test. Listen to me. Do it. Pay special attention to cylinders #3 and #6. The canister is not an easy item to get to, but if you can, take it off and see if it rattles: IF so, you may want to inspect the intake air manifold to the valves.

But that sort of inspection is perhaps over most normal PPI's.

Let us know who might be conducting the tests. CO has a great Ferrari dealership if you are looking locally.

rik

PS: Just happened to remember something.

- Find out the history, RECENT, of the car. Like WHO[!!!] might have worked on it, what might have been done. [ancient history might be cool for long term documentatin but has somewhat little to do with the car's current state or value. IF you find something of interest there, post and get a comment]
- WHEN was the last full done? Mileage is most likely NOT an issue as most Ferraris every see that limit before time expires. Bench mark is 3 years or 30k miles for a full tune and belt replacement. There are exceptions but he/she had better be a good enough mechanic to justify differently.
- BEARINGS is what I would worry as well as belts, and the water pump. ALL those items on any 348/355 require an engine out experience.

IF NONE Of those items are documented, you might want to try another source for a better representation.
IF you are dead set on THAT undocumented exotic, be prepared to budget at least one bank account and a couple of periphery money-storage lockers

ALSO: I no longer recommend K&N Filters. Not getting into a pi$$ing contest here. Still have them in both mine, but believe you'll be better serviced by replaceing them at each respected interval.


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Rik -- LAH !


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Last edited by Granucci; 05-27-2011 at 11:20 AM.
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Old 05-30-2011, 08:38 AM   #16
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Man, so many things to know! I thought I was doing good with the obvious stuff like checking maintenance records, major service info, etc. and the details provided so far are things I didn't even know of or have "experts" even mention.

So a question I've had in mind, though just an opinion question is, how much of a once-over would a seller be willing to let a buyer do or should I ask for? Meaning, some one may have gotten in to a car that may be a little over there head and now it has something up with it. I would like to have as thorough of a check on the car as possible [I know work will be needed at some point] but I would like to minimize any majors in the first few months. Specifically if I am going to fly somewhere to check it out, I'd like a professional opinion. Make sense or am I asking too much?
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Old 05-30-2011, 09:33 AM   #17
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no, you are not asking too much. a professional pre purchase inspection is standard for these cars. Never heard of an owner not being cooperative. If they aren't, move on. I would negotiate the deal and make sure this is the car you want before flying out and/or paying for a ppi. I also am not a big stickler for paperwork going back decades. i would much rather have a very thorough contemporary inspection. Car could have been maintained yearly since it was born and still be ready to fall apart. Could have no records and be the tightest car out there. only one way to really find out....


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Old 05-30-2011, 11:21 AM   #18
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Joshman, I developed a PPI checklist when I bought my Spider. It should take about four hours for a competent Ferrari mech to perform all the items on it. If you want a copy, PM me and I'll send it.
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Old 06-06-2011, 04:15 AM   #19
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Killer58, would love to have that checklist. And thanks wetpet, since reading this site I've become more meticulous on what to look for. Gonna find the right one. Some repairs are okay...majors would suck.
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Old 06-06-2011, 04:40 AM   #20
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Josh, Send my your e-mail address via PM and I'll send you a copy.
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