F355 355F1 pump motor replacement R&D - Ferrari Life
 
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post #1 of 14 Old 03-12-2017, 11:55 AM Thread Starter
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355F1 pump motor replacement R&D

Over the past several months, I have been developing cost-effective and practical solutions to 355 F1 pump motor, which has become almost "unobtanium". The original motors have been manufactured by Valeo electric motors division, which has been sold and resold again and again to other companies, and the production of this particular motor has been discontinued several years ago.

I have been reparing/refurbishing the 355F1 hydraulic power units for FerrParts over the past several years and now I ran out of all of my "new old stock" (NOS) 404.380 Valeo electric motors. However, the demand for this motor is only growing with time. Installation of 360F1 pump with Hill engineering adapter is a well established and tested option, which, however, is not cost-effective (from the cost of work involved to accomplish this); also, some Ferrari 355 owners want to keep their cars as original as possible. Therefore, I developed alternative motors for 355F1 hydraulic gear shifter unit, which is a direct plug-and-play type solution (see attached photos). The black colored motor is slightly longer than the stock motor, which requires a slight readjustment of the hydraulic unit position in the sub-frame (fixing screws should be loosened and the whole unit should be positioned about 0.5-1 inch higher to accommodate the electric motor, which installs from underneath the unit). In both motors, the motor shaft connects with the shaft of internal gear pump via a special spline connector (Oldham type) that is made from Delrin® (small dark brown-colored part in photos), which is provided with the motor and does not require any grease in the coupling.

The silver colored motor does not require any repositioning of hydraulic unit within the F1 mounting subframe, but because this motor is sold by Magneti Marelli it is significantly more expensive than the black-colored motor, which is a conventional OES 12V DC high torque motor that has the same RPM (3600) and draws about 4-5 Amps under load.

Installing this new motor takes only 15-20 minutes, which is certainly faster, much easier, and significantly cheaper, than removing the whole unit for installation of Hill Engineering adapter and 360F1 pump, which requires disconnecting hydraulic lines and removing the whole F1 unit out of the car, customization of sub-frame to accommodate the new 360F1 pump, and reconnecting and re-bleeding hydraulic lines. etc.

Before launching this product on eBay, I would like to test it's performance in several other cars. So, I am looking for "volunteers" who will want to test this motor in their cars. If any of you, DIY-type Ferrari 355F1 owners, are interested, then let me know and I will ship a unit for you to install in your car and test-drive it for a while.

Chiao!
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Last edited by jgelovani; 03-12-2017 at 06:32 PM.
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post #2 of 14 Old 04-05-2017, 02:56 AM
 
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Are there any advantages to this pump over a 360 pump? Or is this simply just an alternative to the 355 pumps that are prone to failure?
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post #3 of 14 Old 04-05-2017, 09:50 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nin10do View Post
Are there any advantages to this pump over a 360 pump? Or is this simply just an alternative to the 355 pumps that are prone to failure?
This is an aftermarket electric motor for 355F1 hydraulic gear shifter power unit. It is a direct plug-and-play model, which does not require any additional modifications of the hydraulic power unit manifold. The motor shaft connects with the shaft of internal gear pump via a special spline connector (Oldham type) that is made from Delrin® (a round dark brown-colored part in photos), which is provided with the motor and does not require any grease in the shaft coupling cavity. Mounting bolts and washers are also provided in the kit.

As I said before, installing this new motor takes only 15-20 minutes, which is certainly faster, much easier, and significantly cheaper ($250-$450 in labor cost or free, if you do it yourself), than removing the whole unit for installation of Hill Engineering adapter and 360F1 pump, which requires disconnecting hydraulic lines and removing the whole F1 unit out of the car, customization of sub-frame to accommodate the new 360F1 pump, and reconnecting and re-bleeding hydraulic lines. etc. (the cost of labor alone varies from shop to shop between $2K to $4K just for that).

The hydraulic pump head in 355F1 is not part of this replacement electric motor, because the pump head is located inside the hydraulic fluid reservoir on the other side of the electric motor mounting plate (see pictures of the pump head below):
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Last edited by jgelovani; 04-05-2017 at 11:09 AM.
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post #4 of 14 Old 04-07-2017, 07:27 AM
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I'm excited to test this pump motor out Juri! Thanks for offering this option.

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post #5 of 14 Old 04-08-2017, 01:13 AM Thread Starter
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Hello,
Thank you for your interest for testing this new motor. However, I have 6 tester requests already and I can not afford more at this time. I will let you knbow when this motor will be offered for sale (probably after a couple of months).
Kind regards,
Juri.

Last edited by jgelovani; 04-08-2017 at 01:40 AM.
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post #6 of 14 Old 04-08-2017, 03:37 AM
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Originally Posted by jgelovani View Post
Hello,
Thank you for your interest for testing this new motor. However, I have 6 tester requests already and I can not afford more at this time. I will let you knbow when this motor will be offered for sale (probably after a couple of months).
Kind regards,
Juri.
My apologies, I thought I was one of the tester's per our prior PM exchanges.

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post #7 of 14 Old 04-09-2017, 12:36 PM Thread Starter
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I sent you a PM to arrange the testing.
Cheers!
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post #8 of 14 Old 04-09-2017, 03:44 PM
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Update


Realistically you cannot do the swap in less than 1.5 hrs.
Motor seems faster rpm wise
Primes faster than OEM
Heat shield and everything stays as original
Larger wires than OEM so draws less amps. (I will check next drive)
Waterproof plug
Concours acceptable
No bleeding of F1 required because no lines including reservoir are disconnected
Made in America

As you can tell I was impressed.

I will keep the forum posted on any other updates.
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post #9 of 14 Old 05-29-2017, 08:27 AM Thread Starter
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Latest model of electric motor for Ferrari 355F1 hydraulic unit is ready for release. It is a direct plug-and-play model, which does not require any additional parts or modifications. This electric motor has been custom manufactured to meet and exceed the original equipment specifications of ITT/VALEO 404.380 motor. It is now offered on eBay: Electric Motor for Ferrari 355F1 Hydraulic Power Unit 177686 | eBay
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post #10 of 14 Old 05-29-2017, 08:34 AM Thread Starter
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Specially manufactured rotor, stator and commutator plate.
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post #11 of 14 Old 05-29-2017, 12:26 PM
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Juri- Very nice work, as usual. Did not realize you were rebuilding actuators. What is the cost for the actuator rebuild?

Taz
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post #12 of 14 Old 05-29-2017, 08:45 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tazandjan View Post
Juri- Very nice work, as usual. Did not realize you were rebuilding actuators. What is the cost for the actuator rebuild?
Yes, I have been repairing 355F1 hydraulic power units for FerrParts and other companies for years. Price depends on what has to be repaired. Typically, it is the motor that has to be replaced. Often an electric socket of a solenoid (junior jumper type) is broken, a couple of O-rings are leaking, or pressure accumulator is damaged and need to be replaced. Recently, I had to replace hydraulic gear pump head, and a pressure sensor a couple of times. So, the price may range from $1200 to $4800. The most expensive ptarts are solenoids, but I found the matching replacement parts that are still in production.

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post #13 of 14 Old 05-29-2017, 09:45 PM
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Juri- Thanks.

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post #14 of 14 Old 06-07-2017, 07:12 PM Thread Starter
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I am happy to report to Ferrari 355F1 owners' community and mechanics who repair these beautiful cars that I developed a cost-effective and practical solution to 355 F1 gear pump head replacement, which has been "unobtanium" from the start, because it has never been sold by Ferrari or Ferrari parts dealers/distributors as a separate part. The original (stock) pump heads have been manufactured by Marzocchi Pompe S.p.A. (Italy), for Hydraulic Ring GmbH (Germay) company, which has been sold and resold a couple of times since the late 1990s - early 2000s. These hydraulic pump heads have not been manufectured by Marzocchi since the original limited production run and this pump model has never been listed in Marzhocchi catalogues.

Although in general these types of gear pump heads are virtually indestructable, they still have a limited life-time, because the inside bearings are made of bronze, which wears out and, as the result, these pumps can not generate sufficient pressure. Consequently, electric motor works overtime and wears out to the point that it fails. During the past 2-3 years the umber of 355F1 units that I have been refurbishing for various mechanics and parts companies increased drammatically, because these cars are now 20 years old and now not only the motors, but also the pump heads are failing progressively, but these pump heads could not be purchased anywhere ! As the result, many 355F1 owners had to use Hill Engineering kit to modify their F1 hydraulic power units by connecting to electrohydraulic pumps from 360F1 cars. However, this solution is cumbersome, is not concourse-compatible, and costly in terms of cost of labor. This actually was the reason to why I became motivated to develop new aftermarket "reproductions" of electric motor and the gear pump head for 355F1.

So, here it is - a "reproduction" and performance upgrade of the original hydraulic gear pump head for 355F1 (Marzocchi part # ZKD169/388A), which I have developed, finally. It is located inside the hydraulic fluid receiving reservoir of hydraulic power unit (Ferrari part # 177686) as indicated by a yellow arrow in the attached picture. For comparison, I also provide pictures of stock pump head (from Marzocchi). The new upgraded pump head has much higher output (0.27 ml/rev) than the stock pump head (0.16 ml/rev), so that the pump cycle is almost twice shorter using this pump head. You can notice the difference in thickness of the middle section of my new pump, which is almost twice wider than that in the old stock pump from Marzocchi. This part is the housing for gears that pump hydraulic fluid while rotating. The wider the gears, the more fluid can be trapped between the gears and pumped out into the high pressure port (a small opening on the shaft side of this pump). When instaled together with the new motor I developed, the pump cycle duration is shortened to only few seconds. These pump heads should last another 25-30 years, because these are made from much better and newer type of materials than stock pump heads.

Thus, a HUGE problem of "unobtanium" parts for 355F1 system, both the electric motor and gear pump head, has finally been solved !!!

Both parts are now offered on eBay:
# New pump with higher output: http://www.ebay.com/itm/252979780864
# New electric motor with higher RPM and torque: http://www.ebay.com/itm/252963873225
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Last edited by jgelovani; 06-07-2017 at 07:48 PM.
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